Author Topic: Letter to the Hebrews  (Read 2290 times)

Description:

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Deborah

  • Bible Buddies - together
  • ******
  • Posts: 480
  • Total likes: 84
  • Thanked: 26 times
  • Gender: Female
  • New :
    • Discovering the Bible
Re: Letter to the Hebrews
« Reply #72 on: April 02, 2018, 11:54:51 AM »
Hi Deborah
Thank you for your reply to which I agree.

Heb 6:18  That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us:
Heb 6:19  Which hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and stedfast, and which entereth into that within the veil;
Heb 6:20  Whither the forerunner is for us entered, even Jesus, made an high priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.
 


V18 Yes we can be absolutely certain that God dose not lie every word we have from him in the scripture is true and will come to pass in the fullness of time the hope set before us to enter his eternal kingdom
v19 let us not abandon this hope but hold fast to it as a ship is held fast by its anchor let us hold fast to the hope set before us our hope is Jesus Christ who has entered behind the vail he is our anchor.
V20 Yes our Lord Jesus Christ has entered through the vail and sits at the right hand of God waiting for all his enemies to be made his footstool let us pray that day will soon come and let us pray for it Thy Kingdom come thy will be done we have the sure and certain promises of our God and we know this will happen.

Love and Peace
Dave

Amen! v19 is one of my favourite Bible verses.

v18 God's word alone should be sufficient assurance; for He will never go back on it (Numbers 23:19). But since He is also the Guarantor of His word, we can be doubly sure that there is no possibility of us being deceived or disappointed.
"We who have fled to take hold of the hope set before us..." Just as under the old covenant people could take refuge in God's sanctuary by clinging to the altar, so under the new covenant we can find security by clinging to the trustworthy promises of God.
v19 A well-placed anchor is an invisible link with the solid seabed, keeping a ship securely in position even while it's being battered and tossed by storms. Similarly, our spiritual 'anchor' is grounded in "the inner sanctuary, behind the curtain." So we can be sure of our salvation!
v20 Jesus is our link between the visible world and the invisible presence of God. Having entered the Most Holy Place, He is now enthroned there (unlike the Jewish high priests who always came out again), giving us confidence that we will one day follow Him and share in His eternal glory.
"Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength." (Mark 12:30)

Offline davetaff

  • Moderator
  • ***
  • Posts: 1689
  • Total likes: 113
  • Thanked: 49 times
  • Gender: Male
  • New :God is Love
Re: Letter to the Hebrews
« Reply #73 on: April 03, 2018, 02:41:19 PM »
Hi Deborah
thank you for your reply very good as usual now on to the tricky bit :undecided:

Heb 7:1  For this Melchisedec, king of Salem, priest of the most high God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him;
Heb 7:2  To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all; first being by interpretation King of righteousness, and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace;
Heb 7:3  Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually.
   


V1 So here we have the mysterious Melchisedec we know he is the king of peace and high priest and he is greater than abraham because he blessed him.
V2 Abraham gave a tenth of the spoils this mirrors the people of Israel who gave tithes to the Levites the priests of the temple he is said to be a king of righteousness and Peace.
V3 It seams he was not born of woman he had no beginning and no end but a priest forever as Our Lord is.

There is very little said about this Melchisedec but it is obvious that he was great there is much speculation about wether he is Christ a Christophany I feel this a posibility but not sure.
are there other incidents in scripture which may have bean Christophany there is Enoch he was born of a woman of course but did not die because God took him reminds us of Christ.
There was also Elijah he also did not die but taken up in a chariot of fire jest a little speculation on my part but these things makes one wonder do they not.

love and Peace
Dave

Offline Deborah

  • Bible Buddies - together
  • ******
  • Posts: 480
  • Total likes: 84
  • Thanked: 26 times
  • Gender: Female
  • New :
    • Discovering the Bible
Re: Letter to the Hebrews
« Reply #74 on: April 03, 2018, 09:19:21 PM »
Hi Deborah
thank you for your reply very good as usual now on to the tricky bit :undecided:

Heb 7:1  For this Melchisedec, king of Salem, priest of the most high God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him;
Heb 7:2  To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all; first being by interpretation King of righteousness, and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace;
Heb 7:3  Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually.
   


V1 So here we have the mysterious Melchisedec we know he is the king of peace and high priest and he is greater than abraham because he blessed him.
V2 Abraham gave a tenth of the spoils this mirrors the people of Israel who gave tithes to the Levites the priests of the temple he is said to be a king of righteousness and Peace.
V3 It seams he was not born of woman he had no beginning and no end but a priest forever as Our Lord is.

There is very little said about this Melchisedec but it is obvious that he was great there is much speculation about wether he is Christ a Christophany I feel this a posibility but not sure.
are there other incidents in scripture which may have bean Christophany there is Enoch he was born of a woman of course but did not die because God took him reminds us of Christ.
There was also Elijah he also did not die but taken up in a chariot of fire jest a little speculation on my part but these things makes one wonder do they not.

love and Peace
Dave

At last we get to Melchizedek - a fascinating and enigmatic character. As you say, we know next to nothing about him - which is why people speculate so much about him being Shem (an ancient Jewish tradition) or Christ, or someone else.

(You do like speculating, don't you Dave!  :wink: Enoch may have been Christ because he was born of a woman? Everyone was born of a woman! Why does the fact he didn't die remind you of Christ, when Christ did die? And we know that Elijah wasn't Christ because during Jesus' transfiguration He talked with Elijah!)

But for the writer of this letter, this is all nonsense. Melchizedek is "like" Christ - not a pre-incarnation appearance of Christ.
v1,2 The first interesting fact about Melchizedek is that he was both a king and a priest (in fact, the very first priest to be mentioned in the Bible). It's very very unusual for one person to have both roles. He was king of Salem (the name Salem means 'peace'), and his name means 'king of righteousness'. The second interesting fact is that, although he was a Gentile (not one of God's chosen people), he was a priest of the true God.
v3 The third interesting fact is that his genealogy is not recorded (again, this is unusual for a person of significance). Arguments from silence are generally weak arguments; but in a book such as Genesis, where genealogies are considered highly important, the writer thinks this omission must be significant. The Levitical priests had to preserve their genealogies carefully because that was their main qualification for office (see Ezra 2:62); the point is that Melchizedek was a priest in his own right, not by virtue of his ancestry.
The Levitical priesthood was handed down from father to son; but Melchizedek had neither predecessors nor successors. Since there is no record of either the beginning or end of his priesthood, it is to all intents and purposes timeless.
In all these ways, his priesthood foreshadows that of Christ. Which is hardly surprising, because in the prophetic Psalm 110, Jesus is appointed priest "in the order of Melchizedek."

Another interesting thing about Melchizedek which isn't mentioned in this letter is that when he met Abraham he brought "bread and wine" with him (Genesis 14:18) - the ingredients of the Lord's Supper. Whenever we take Communion we are being 'served' and blessed by our high priest Jesus just as Abraham was served and blessed by Melchizedek.
"Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength." (Mark 12:30)

Offline davetaff

  • Moderator
  • ***
  • Posts: 1689
  • Total likes: 113
  • Thanked: 49 times
  • Gender: Male
  • New :God is Love
Re: Letter to the Hebrews
« Reply #75 on: April 05, 2018, 04:27:34 PM »
Hi Deborah
Thank you for an other good post hope you don't mind me speculating some times I do feel its important to say we are speculating bit like fishing to see what one mite catch.

Heb 7:4  Now consider how great this man was, unto whom even the patriarch Abraham gave the tenth of the spoils.
Heb 7:5  And verily they that are of the sons of Levi, who receive the office of the priesthood, have a commandment to take tithes of the people according to the law, that is, of their brethren, though they come out of the loins of Abraham:
Heb 7:6  But he whose descent is not counted from them received tithes of Abraham, and blessed him that had the promises.
Heb 7:7  And without all contradiction the less is blessed of the better.
   


V4 in considering this high priest of god most high why would he need a tenth of the spoils as I understand it the tithes paid to the priests was for the upkeep of the Temple and there wages.
the question that arises is was this high priest human or angelic did he need the tithes or was it jest a symbolic gester on behalf of Abraham but if this high priest was Christ was the giving of tithes a form of worship.
more questions than answers I'm afraid.
V5 here we have the reason why the tithes are paid to the priest it is a statute in the law given to Moses but the Law came a long time after Abraham met Melchizedek so how did Abram know about paying tithes.
V6 we see here that Melchizedek had no connection to Abraham he jest appears from nowhere and disappears jest as mysteriously which makes me more inclined to believe he is a  Christophany.
V7 here no doubt  is left in our minds  the greater blesses the lesser Abraham who was a great man the founder of Gods people Israel when Melchizedek blessed Abraham did he also bless Israel who are the decedents of Abraham.

Love and Peace
Dave   

Offline Deborah

  • Bible Buddies - together
  • ******
  • Posts: 480
  • Total likes: 84
  • Thanked: 26 times
  • Gender: Female
  • New :
    • Discovering the Bible
Re: Letter to the Hebrews
« Reply #76 on: April 07, 2018, 09:15:31 AM »
Hi Deborah
Thank you for an other good post hope you don't mind me speculating some times I do feel its important to say we are speculating bit like fishing to see what one mite catch.

Heb 7:4  Now consider how great this man was, unto whom even the patriarch Abraham gave the tenth of the spoils.
Heb 7:5  And verily they that are of the sons of Levi, who receive the office of the priesthood, have a commandment to take tithes of the people according to the law, that is, of their brethren, though they come out of the loins of Abraham:
Heb 7:6  But he whose descent is not counted from them received tithes of Abraham, and blessed him that had the promises.
Heb 7:7  And without all contradiction the less is blessed of the better.
   


V4 in considering this high priest of god most high why would he need a tenth of the spoils as I understand it the tithes paid to the priests was for the upkeep of the Temple and there wages.
the question that arises is was this high priest human or angelic did he need the tithes or was it jest a symbolic gester on behalf of Abraham but if this high priest was Christ was the giving of tithes a form of worship.
more questions than answers I'm afraid.
V5 here we have the reason why the tithes are paid to the priest it is a statute in the law given to Moses but the Law came a long time after Abraham met Melchizedek so how did Abram know about paying tithes.
V6 we see here that Melchizedek had no connection to Abraham he jest appears from nowhere and disappears jest as mysteriously which makes me more inclined to believe he is a  Christophany.
V7 here no doubt  is left in our minds  the greater blesses the lesser Abraham who was a great man the founder of Gods people Israel when Melchizedek blessed Abraham did he also bless Israel who are the decedents of Abraham.

Love and Peace
Dave   

Melchizedek didn't "need" a tenth of the spoils. It was Abraham's way of recognising his spiritual authority (as "Priest of God Most High").
Tithing is a very old principle - much older than the Jewish Law. Jacob also tithed - he promised to give God a tenth of his income (Genesis 28:22).
As I said earlier, Scripture says Melchizedek was LIKE Christ - not Christ Himself.
The writer's point is this: Melchizedek was 'outside' the Law and didn't get his priestly authority from the Law (as the Levites did). Nevertheless, he did have priestly authority - and Abraham recognised it. It is therefore possible for Jesus to have priestly authority from 'outside' the Law (i.e. from a different source, the same source as Melchizedek, direct from God). This was very important for the original readers of the letter, who were Jewish, but is only a matter of interest to us.
"Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength." (Mark 12:30)

Offline davetaff

  • Moderator
  • ***
  • Posts: 1689
  • Total likes: 113
  • Thanked: 49 times
  • Gender: Male
  • New :God is Love
Re: Letter to the Hebrews
« Reply #77 on: April 07, 2018, 05:40:55 PM »
Hi Deborah
Thank you for your reply I think the subject of Melchizedek is fascinating but think it better to move on before I go of on a tangent maybe the subject needs it's own thread.

.8  And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth.

 9  And as I may so say, Levi also, who receiveth tithes, payed tithes in Abraham.

 10  For he was yet in the loins of his father, when Melchisedec met him.

 11  If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron     


Interesting about this mention of Levi paying tithes through Abraham it shows how important heritage is.
V11 interesting here is the statement that the first priesthood was not perfect it became corrupted and had to be replaced making it necessary for our lord to come and put thing right by his perfect sacrifice which cleanses us from sin through forgiveness.

Love and Peace
Dave

Offline Deborah

  • Bible Buddies - together
  • ******
  • Posts: 480
  • Total likes: 84
  • Thanked: 26 times
  • Gender: Female
  • New :
    • Discovering the Bible
Re: Letter to the Hebrews
« Reply #78 on: April 12, 2018, 10:00:50 PM »
Hi Deborah
Thank you for your reply I think the subject of Melchizedek is fascinating but think it better to move on before I go of on a tangent maybe the subject needs it's own thread.

.8  And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth.

 9  And as I may so say, Levi also, who receiveth tithes, payed tithes in Abraham.

 10  For he was yet in the loins of his father, when Melchisedec met him.

 11  If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron     


Interesting about this mention of Levi paying tithes through Abraham it shows how important heritage is.
V11 interesting here is the statement that the first priesthood was not perfect it became corrupted and had to be replaced making it necessary for our lord to come and put thing right by his perfect sacrifice which cleanses us from sin through forgiveness.

Love and Peace
Dave
v8-10 Effectively, the Levites paid tithes to Melchizedek via their ancestor Abraham. This implies that Melchizedek's priesthood is greater than theirs.

Now we leave Melchizedek himself and start a new section, contrasting Jesus with the Levitical priests.
v11 So what about the Levitical priesthood? If their ministry had been spiritually effective, there would have been no need to reinstate the priesthood of Melchizedek. The priesthood did become corrupted, as you say; but it was imperfect even from the beginning. In fact God never intended it to be anything other than a stopgap - a  temporary measure.
"Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength." (Mark 12:30)

Offline davetaff

  • Moderator
  • ***
  • Posts: 1689
  • Total likes: 113
  • Thanked: 49 times
  • Gender: Male
  • New :God is Love
Re: Letter to the Hebrews
« Reply #79 on: April 14, 2018, 02:39:14 PM »
Hi Deborah
Thank you for your reply

Heb 7:12  For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.
Heb 7:13  For he of whom these things are spoken pertaineth to another tribe, of which no man gave attendance at the altar.
Heb 7:14  For it is evident that our Lord sprang out of Juda; of which tribe Moses spake nothing concerning priesthood.
Heb 7:15  And it is yet far more evident: for that after the similitude of it was to be based there ariseth another priest,
     


V12 so the old priesthood is done away with I believe this happened when they rejected our lord what's interesting here is what changed in the law for myself I believe that what changed was how we were to comply with the law I believe we were to keep the law through love if we love God love our neighbour and love our enemies then we keep the law as our lord did.
Our lord said that nothing in the law would disappear until everything was fulfilled so the law remains its how we comply with the law that's changed.
V 13'14 Here we see that there is a clean break with the old priesthood they were completely cut of and a new priesthood was brought in of which our Lord is the high priest.
V 15 So this new priesthood was to be entirely different to the old it was to be based on Melchisedec who was a priest without beginning or end of days so our Lord would be a priest forever not as the old priests who died and had to be replaced our lord is a priest for ever and can be relied on in all generations how wonderful is that.

Love and Peace
Dave