Author Topic: Persuasion  (Read 69 times)

Description:

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Cariad

  • Awarded Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 160
  • Total likes: 5
  • Thanked: 14 times
  • Welcome our New Member
Persuasion
« on: October 22, 2017, 07:17:06 PM »

Welcome to the Biblical and Theology Section of 1Faith

[Raise a Debate] @ 1faith

Your post will be answered shortly

Raise a Debate - by posting bait !
Hello there,

Recent discussions make me feel it necessary to tell you that I am a dispensationalist by persuasion.  I have not thought it necessary before, but it may explain what you had perhaps began to guess by the difference of my approach compared to other members with whom I have entered into discussion here.

I have not sat under the ministry of any assembly for many years: but have, for the same duration, benefited from the ministry, by literature and audio message, of The Berean Publishing Trust, of Wilson Street London, which is a ministry which is dispensational in nature, based on the principle of 2 Timothy 2:15.  http://www.bereanonline.org/

My main preoccupation is Christ and the grace of God which has saved me, based on His finished work: I am not here to promote anything other than His person, His work, and the Word of God which makes Him known.  However, if what I have told you is a problem to anyone, then you must tell me, and I will do what is necessary.

With love In Christ Jesus
Cariad




http://www.bereanonline.org/


The following users thanked this post: Rose Anna

Welcome to the Biblical and Theology Section of 1Faith

[Raise a Debate] @ 1faith

Your post will be answered shortly

Raise a Debate - by posting bait !

Offline francis drake

Re: Persuasion
« Reply #1 on: October 22, 2017, 08:39:53 PM »
Hello there,

Recent discussions make me feel it necessary to tell you that I am a dispensationalist by persuasion.  I have not thought it necessary before, but it may explain what you had perhaps began to guess by the difference of my approach compared to other members with whom I have entered into discussion here.

I have not sat under the ministry of any assembly for many years: but have, for the same duration, benefited from the ministry, by literature and audio message, of The Berean Publishing Trust, of Wilson Street London, which is a ministry which is dispensational in nature, based on the principle of 2 Timothy 2:15.  http://www.bereanonline.org/

My main preoccupation is Christ and the grace of God which has saved me, based on His finished work: I am not here to promote anything other than His person, His work, and the Word of God which makes Him known.  However, if what I have told you is a problem to anyone, then you must tell me, and I will do what is necessary.

With love In Christ Jesus
Cariad

You don't fancy giving a run down on the principles of dispensationalism do you @Cariad.

I suspect that it is where I started off back in the early 70s in a solid bible teaching church. I'm sure we'll disagree on the subject but am not clear enough to be that certain.



http://www.bereanonline.org/
Disturb us Lord, when we are too pleased with ourselves. When our dreams have come true because we dreamed too little. When we arrived safely because we sailed too close to the shore. Disturb us Lord, to dare more boldly. To venture on wider seas. Where storms will show your mastery; Where, losing sight of land, we shall find the stars. We ask you to push back the horizons of our hopes; And to push into the future, in strength, courage, hope and love.                     (SIR FRANCIS DRAKE 1577)

Offline Cariad

  • Awarded Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 160
  • Total likes: 5
  • Thanked: 14 times
  • Welcome our New Member
Re: Persuasion
« Reply #2 on: October 23, 2017, 09:24:23 AM »
You don't fancy giving a run down on the principles of dispensationalism do you @Cariad.

I suspect that it is where I started off back in the early 70s in a solid bible teaching church. I'm sure we'll disagree on the subject but am not clear enough to be that certain.
@francis drake

Hi f.d.,

I will do that. God willing.

With love,
In Christ Jesus
Cariad

Offline Cariad

  • Awarded Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 160
  • Total likes: 5
  • Thanked: 14 times
  • Welcome our New Member
Re: Persuasion
« Reply #3 on: October 23, 2017, 01:07:17 PM »
Hello there,

When taking part in discussions on a forum, many years ago now, I met with a very forceful and insulting individual, who used personal attack as a weapon: and the content of my responses caused him to start calling me a 'dispensationalist' in a derogatory manner, along with accusing me of heresy.  Believe it or not I had never thought of myself as a dispensationalist, that word had never entered my head in association with myself.  So I had to look it up online, and was horrified with what I found there; I found doctrines that I would never want to identify myself with, and criticism of the most negative kind. That said, I will try to give an outline, of what I believe is entailed in being of this persuasion:-

* It is all based on 2 Timothy 2:15, and the principle of, '... rightly dividing the word of truth.' This governs our approach to the Scriptures. The desire is to be 'approved unto God', and an, 'unashamed workman'.

* Miles Coverdale, the eminent Bible Translator, approached Bible Study, using the following questions, which are helpful in doing this:-

`It shall greatly helpe ye to understande Scripture,
if thou mark
not only what is spoken, or wrytten,
but of whom,
and to whom,
with what words,
at what time,
where,
to what intent,
with what circumstance,
considering what goeth before, and what followeth'.

* For me it is a means to an end, that end being an understanding of what is written.  In doing so, you find that though 'all Scripture' is for us (2 Tim. 3:16), not all Scripture is, about us.  That God spoke 'at sundry times' and in 'divers manners' (Heb. 1:1), and that it is important to read the address on the envelope to make sure it is addressed to you, as a believer in this dispensation; and not to some other company for whom the requirements of God were very different.

* That is the beginning of my explanation, for in rightly dividing the Word of God, in this manner, you find out what your own calling is, it's hope, it's destination, it's obligation, it's inheritance, and it puts you at odds sometimes with what is traditionally practised in Christendom.  This is what brings the name calling and condemnation.

* This is not going to be explained in one post, I'm afraid, but if you will bear with me, I will try to explain further.

Thank you.
In Christ Jesus
Cariad


PS:
If you do look online: I personally identify closely with such as
Dr E.W. Bullinger, and Mr C.H.Welch, who are called by their critics,
'Ultra Dispensationalists'; and with no other.

Offline Rose Anna

Re: Persuasion
« Reply #4 on: October 23, 2017, 03:42:27 PM »
Hi Cariad.
Just to say thank you for sharing this.
I don't look at any labels and the suggested theology that fits them. Thats because I see you as a child of God.

 Part of a Royal Priesthood. Someone like others here and myself, as seeking the truth.
Many people are finding their identity through labels, and in doing so attach to certain theologies in connection to them, without actually seeking the truth.
That identity maybe cultural, traditional, intellectual but fulfils that need to have identity.
Just to me there are those of us who surrender the identity, in exchange of the truth and identity in Christ.
It saddens me that in journeying into the truth that people can put manmade labels on that, and categorise, when truth is searched, discussed or written. If ever we make a mistake in seeking the truth. Its a genuine mistake. Which I believe is very different from heresy. For nobody has the complete truth yet, except Christ. I feel its important to make that distinction.

For its outside of the box when genuinely walking with God.

I know you are like some of us here. As said, and see you as a child of God. Nothing else matters.


Offline Cariad

  • Awarded Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 160
  • Total likes: 5
  • Thanked: 14 times
  • Welcome our New Member
Re: Persuasion
« Reply #5 on: October 24, 2017, 12:20:48 PM »
Thank you, Rose Anna.

Of God, we are 'in Christ Jesus'! Now that is one box I don't mind being put in: and I don't mind wearing that label blazoned upon my chest for all to see.  Being judged to be dispensational doesn't offend me either, except when it is used for an excuse to evade a line of reasoning, which simply doesn't fit the framework of the teaching another has received. 

In Christ Jesus
Cariad

Offline francis drake

Re: Persuasion
« Reply #6 on: October 24, 2017, 09:31:45 PM »
You may be amused at this @Cariad.

When I was a relatively new Christian back in the 70s, I tried a variety of bibles without finding one I liked. Then one day a friend in our house group gave me a Scofield Reference bible. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scofield_Reference_Bible)

You probably know that Scofield is a famous dispensationalist!

I immediately loved it and found it an excellent read with countless valuable notes and marginal references. Over the years I added my own notes and cross references as the Lord led me to them. I also crossed out notes I disagreed with.

With constant hard use, the leathercloth cover eventually disintegrated, the concordance pages at the back and the intro pages at the front shredded more and more leaves. The bible fell apart and people started offering to buy me a new one.

I had to do something, but I didn't want a new bible as my Scofield bible was so valuable.
The problem is that the Scofield bible was published around the early 1900s. My copy was ancient and no longer in print, but eventually I found a second hand copy. This was long before Amazon.

I then sat down and went through page by page and neatly transcribed my notes till my new Scofield was a worthy successor to my original.
I have done the same thing 3 or 4 times now, and thanks to Amazon, have another 2 ancient but good copies in reserve.

Anyway, that's my dispensationalist background.
But after decades of walking with the Lord, as much as Scofield and I remain friends, we have agreed to differ on that subject.

If Cyrus Scofield and I can remain good friends for so many years, I am sure you and I can remain good friends despite our differences.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scofield_Reference_Bible
Disturb us Lord, when we are too pleased with ourselves. When our dreams have come true because we dreamed too little. When we arrived safely because we sailed too close to the shore. Disturb us Lord, to dare more boldly. To venture on wider seas. Where storms will show your mastery; Where, losing sight of land, we shall find the stars. We ask you to push back the horizons of our hopes; And to push into the future, in strength, courage, hope and love.                     (SIR FRANCIS DRAKE 1577)

Offline Cariad

  • Awarded Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 160
  • Total likes: 5
  • Thanked: 14 times
  • Welcome our New Member
Re: Persuasion
« Reply #7 on: October 25, 2017, 10:42:27 AM »
'These were more noble that those in Thessalonica,
in that they received the word with all readiness of mind,
and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so'

(Acts 17:11)

@francis drake

Hello f.d.,

I am glad to hear that you adopted the Berean spirit, and took what was said and heard to the Scriptures for confirmation.  Thank you for sharing your experiences, and for the reassuring content of your last sentence, particularly.

I have not read the Schofield Bible myself, but have heard of it.  I do have The Companion Bible, compiled by Dr.E.W.Bullinger.  However, as another writer to whom I am indebted said, 'Don't take my word for it, search the Scriptures for yourself, and then you will know if what I have said is true or not', (Mr C.H.Welch), and I do. 

Your entry was a joy,
Thank you.
In Christ Jesus
Cariad

Welcome to the Biblical and Theology Section of 1Faith

[Raise a Debate] @ 1faith

Your post will be answered shortly

Raise a Debate - by posting bait !