Author Topic: How good a christian do you think Moses was?  (Read 530 times)

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Offline francis drake

Re: How good a christian do you think Moses was?
« Reply #8 on: August 27, 2017, 09:21:44 PM »


Thats quite a deep but interesting question. I dont know if Im answering correctly.  Would you mind expanding my answer?
Sorry Rose Anna, I'm not going to expand your answer as you are doing very well already. Just keep pressing deeper.
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It seems to me that although it was before Christ was born in human form He was obviously alive as the Word of God and known.
Too right!
Who was it who walked in the garden with Adam?
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To know has a deeper context. 1 Samuel 3:7 1 Samuel 3:21
Too right again!
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From the relationship with God the people had a revelation of what was valid and valuable in God's Kingdom and what wasnt by the worlds values.[/b]
Amen.
Disturb us Lord, when we are too pleased with ourselves. When our dreams have come true because we dreamed too little. When we arrived safely because we sailed too close to the shore. Disturb us Lord, to dare more boldly. To venture on wider seas. Where storms will show your mastery; Where, losing sight of land, we shall find the stars. We ask you to push back the horizons of our hopes; And to push into the future, in strength, courage, hope and love.                     (SIR FRANCIS DRAKE 1577)
The following users thanked this post: Rose Anna

Offline francis drake

Re: How good a christian do you think Moses was?
« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2017, 07:15:08 PM »
Good answer @Rose Anna.
But what do you think it means, "esteeming the reproach of Christ", when Christ had not been born?
And of course @Rose Anna, we know its not just Moses is it?

Heb11 lists many of the patriarchs of faith who walked in relationship with Christ.
4By faith Abel offered to God a better sacrifice than Cain, through which he obtained the testimony that he was righteous, God testifying about his gifts, and through faith, though he is dead, he still speaks.
5By faith Enoch..........
7By faith Noah,...........
8By faith Abraham.....
11By faith even Sarah..........
20By faith Isaac..........
21By faith Jacob,.....
22By faith Joseph, ....
23By faith Moses....... (Actually, this refers to the faith of his mother not Moses!)
24By faith Moses,..........26considering the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures of Egypt;
31By faith Rahab the harlot..........
32............time will fail me if I tell of Gideon, Barak, Samson, Jephthah, of David and Samuel and the prophets, 33who by faith....
Disturb us Lord, when we are too pleased with ourselves. When our dreams have come true because we dreamed too little. When we arrived safely because we sailed too close to the shore. Disturb us Lord, to dare more boldly. To venture on wider seas. Where storms will show your mastery; Where, losing sight of land, we shall find the stars. We ask you to push back the horizons of our hopes; And to push into the future, in strength, courage, hope and love.                     (SIR FRANCIS DRAKE 1577)

Offline Rose Anna

Re: How good a christian do you think Moses was?
« Reply #10 on: August 28, 2017, 07:34:37 PM »
What is interesting about the people of God there in Hebrew 11 is that they are commended for their faith.
Yet in other ways they showed their human weaknesses, mistakes and failures.
Doesnt it show how amazing God's grace is and that He can turn anyone around to be a great person of God, despite their background and failures. It just takes the humility to be the clay in God the Makers hands, to be the person He designed us to be.

Offline francis drake

Re: How good a christian do you think Moses was?
« Reply #11 on: August 28, 2017, 10:28:46 PM »
What is interesting about the people of God there in Hebrew 11 is that they are commended for their faith.
Yet in other ways they showed their human weaknesses, mistakes and failures.
Doesnt it show how amazing God's grace is and that He can turn anyone around to be a great person of God, despite their background and failures. It just takes the humility to be the clay in God the Makers hands, to be the person He designed us to be.


Agreed.

Christians act as if Grace was a new invention in the New Testament.

Reality is that Law and Grace have run concurrent as two parallel streams from Adam onwards.

Disturb us Lord, when we are too pleased with ourselves. When our dreams have come true because we dreamed too little. When we arrived safely because we sailed too close to the shore. Disturb us Lord, to dare more boldly. To venture on wider seas. Where storms will show your mastery; Where, losing sight of land, we shall find the stars. We ask you to push back the horizons of our hopes; And to push into the future, in strength, courage, hope and love.                     (SIR FRANCIS DRAKE 1577)

Offline Tes Johnson

Re: How good a christian do you think Moses was?
« Reply #12 on: August 29, 2017, 02:39:40 AM »
So, what do people think?

How good a Christian was Moses?


Moses was an awful example of a christian...

Why on earth would you follow - Rahab ?


What sort of example is this ?



How disgusting...  blahhhh

Are you sayjng that I should sleep around and become a harlot ?

Is Rahab really a person I should follow or a person I should learn from !

I would never follow Rahab and her ways

Break all the commandments and still be okay _REALLY ...  :-X

NO - how dare you...




Offline Rose Anna

Re: How good a christian do you think Moses was?
« Reply #13 on: August 29, 2017, 09:41:50 AM »
Agreed.

Christians act as if Grace was a new invention in the New Testament.

Reality is that Law and Grace have run concurrent as two parallel streams from Adam onwards.


Hebrews 11 is an example of how christians of all time , both of old and new testament had a relationship with God and through faith.

Hebrews 11:1
Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
Hebrews 11:3
By faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that the things which are seen were not made of things which are visible.
Although God's people did not have the teachings of grace under the new testament as we have, they expressed it in a different way. Just two examples:

Through the Lords mercies we are not consumed,
Because His compassions fail not.
They are new every morning;
Great is Your faithfulness.
Lamentations 3:22-23

Notice " they are new every morning."

David also expressed grace in a different way through: Psalm106


Offline davetaff

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Re: How good a christian do you think Moses was?
« Reply #14 on: August 29, 2017, 10:54:41 AM »
Hi
Just a few random thought's to be a Christian do we not have to be reborn into the body of Christ through the baptism of water and fire.

Of course Israel went through two baptisms one through the Red sea this is when the nation was born.
The second baptism was when through the Jorden of course this was the younger generation all those who came out of Egypt died in the wilderness except two.

This was Israel's rebirth as a nation but Moses was not part of that rebirth.

So the question remain was Moses a Christian I think the answer has to be no because nowhere in scripture can I find that Moses was reborn into the body of Christ.

Having said that I do believe that Mose's and all the men of faith chosen by Christ will be with him at the resurrection and sit in Judgement with him.

Love and Peace
Dave


Offline Rose Anna

Re: How good a christian do you think Moses was?
« Reply #15 on: August 29, 2017, 11:41:07 AM »
It can only be God's grace - through the blood of Jesus that atones to declare anyone righteous. Therefore His blood redeems, justified  and transformed people at all times, in rebirth in the spirit.
For under the law no one is righteous at all times.
The righteous live by faith.
Galatians 3:11
Habakkuk 2:4
Genesis 15:6
Abraham believed in the LORD; and he counted it to him for righteousness.

Although Israel observed the law and gave animal sacrifices, these in themself did not unite them to the Lord.
He abhorred them when their heart was not towards Him. Like praising Him with their lips but their heart was far away.
God was not looking at the outward appearance but for the sincerety of heart towards Him.
Thats what He looked at in their behaviour. If they followed the law and gave sacrifices, it was only pleasing to Him if their heart was truely towards Him, although those things by themselves could never make atonement and justification.
Without their heart being towards Him is being without faith and meaningless.

The question arises why was the law given if by observing and following it no one is justified and declared as righteous.
Its an instruction to live in harmony with others but pinpoints through love.
If we love others then we dont steal from them or slander them.
As a result of the love of God.
By loving Him with all your heart and might, in response to Him loving you and motivating you to be led by Him.

Only no one has done that at all times and has done that perfectly.

No one can keep the law perfectly and so by that be brought to conviction before God.
The ten commandments were given as instructions of God's standards for harmonius living. Yet also to mainly pinpoint everyones short comings and for them to admit them before God and receive His mercy. As a means through union in Him to fulfill the law, and to be atoned for in all failings.

Romans 3:19-29
Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight,for by the law is the knowledge of sin.