Author Topic: Do you believe in Evolution?  (Read 24795 times)

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Offline John

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Re: Do you believe in Evolution?
« Reply #48 on: May 06, 2019, 06:08:16 PM »
Dave,
          "What does one flesh mean it mean they are inseparable they become one this is man in  the image of God."

You are using the image of marriage to show man. That is true only in that they are one, but they are still individuals responcible before God and to each other.

"Man in the image of God is the pinnacle of creation which is Christ at his second coming the end of the creation."

You are saying that Christ is the pinacle of creation, that Jesus is a created being.

If you don't mean these things Dave, don't say them.

Offline davetaff

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Re: Do you believe in Evolution?
« Reply #49 on: May 07, 2019, 05:17:36 PM »
Dave,
          "What does one flesh mean it mean they are inseparable they become one this is man in  the image of God."

You are using the image of marriage to show man. That is true only in that they are one, but they are still individuals responcible before God and to each other.
.Hi John
We are not talking about a man and woman we are talking about Christ and his bride the church   when they are united at his second coming they become one Christ the head the church his body United for eternity   


"Man in the image of God is the pinnacle of creation which is Christ at his second coming the end of the creation."

You are saying that Christ is the pinacle of creation, that Jesus is a created being.
. No I am not saying that we know that Christ is the first and the last the alfa and omega and that all things are created through him and for him and the end of that creation process is man in the image of God of which Christ is the head and  his bride the church his body     

If you don't mean these things Dave, don't say them.Dave

Love and Peace
Dave

Offline John

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Re: Do you believe in Evolution?
« Reply #50 on: May 13, 2019, 05:12:06 PM »
Dave,
              But we are talking about man, not about Jesus and his church.
We are decentants of Adam and Eve and like them are made in the image of God.
Not that we look like God, but that we are Spiritual, reasoning, moral beings.

As you say Jesus created all things and the peak of what he created is man, sinnful fallen man, who Jesus came to die for.

Yes Jesus is the first and the last, that is a matter of status, not a created order.

Yes Jesus is the bridegroom to the 'church', these is not a literal wedding, it is symbolic demonstrating the importance of marriage and the value that Jesus places on us his bride.

Offline davetaff

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Re: Do you believe in Evolution?
« Reply #51 on: May 13, 2019, 06:35:31 PM »
Dave,
              But we are talking about man, not about Jesus and his church.
We are decentants of Adam and Eve and like them are made in the image of God.
Not that we look like God, but that we are Spiritual, reasoning, moral beings.

As you say Jesus created all things and the peak of what he created is man, sinnful fallen man, who Jesus came to die for.

Yes Jesus is the first and the last, that is a matter of status, not a created order.

Yes Jesus is the bridegroom to the 'church', these is not a literal wedding, it is symbolic demonstrating the importance of marriage and the value that Jesus places on us his bride.

Hi John
Thank you for your reply but I am talking about man in the image of God which is Christ United with his bride the Adam and eve I am talking about is Israel.
Man in the image of God has not been finished yet.

Man in the image of God who or what is he I say this will only be realised at the end of Christ's millennial reign when Christ will have reigned for 1000 years as king of kings and all mankind is living in Love and harmony taking care of God's creation as was God's intention from the beginning.

The first man God created in his image of this creation is Israel " out of Egypt I called my son" comes to mind this is applied to Israel and Christ the first and the last Adam.


Love and Peace
Dave

Offline John

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Re: Do you believe in Evolution?
« Reply #52 on: May 14, 2019, 06:50:54 PM »
Dave,
            The bible says in genesis ,' Let us make man in our image...... So God created man in his own image, male and femail he created them.


It is talking about Adam and eve and all the sons of Adam and daughters of Eve that followed.

That this image in us is marred means we will only truely be in God's image when Jesus takes to be with him.

Offline davetaff

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Re: Do you believe in Evolution?
« Reply #53 on: May 15, 2019, 02:42:56 PM »
Dave,
            The bible says in genesis ,' Let us make man in our image...... So God created man in his own image, male and femail he created them.


It is talking about Adam and eve and all the sons of Adam and daughters of Eve that followed.

That this image in us is marred means we will only truely be in God's image when Jesus takes to be with him.

Hi John
Thank you for your reply the only difference  we have is the word man does it mean one man or mankind I see it as mankind and this will be achieved  in Christ at his second coming.
In my opinion when God said the above mankind already existed  other wise how did Cain find a wife and where did all the people come from in the land of Nod enough to build a city
The man referred to here is Christ the head of the body the woman is his bride the chur
ch.
What we need to resolve is what dose man in the image of God look like what dose the first Adam look like.
As you know I believe Israel is the first Adam of this creation Chist was the head the woman was the priesthood his helper and it will be the same with the last Adam Christ will de the head and the church the woman.

Love and peace
Dave
 

Offline John

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Re: Do you believe in Evolution?
« Reply #54 on: May 16, 2019, 04:58:17 PM »
Dave,
            "In my opinion when God said the above mankind already existed  other wise how did Cain find a wife and where did all the people come from in the land of Nod enough to build a city."

That is your opinion, set against what scripture says, that God created Adam from the dust of the ground.

What should you believe. scripture or your imagination.

What does the devil say to Eve, ' Did God really say...'  Well what did God say that he did?

The old challenge.'Where did Cain get his wife?'
If Adam and Eve were the only humans, they would have had Children. Those children would marry brother to sister to produce more children who wqould find partners among there cousens etc.

You are going Eeeew. God only forbad these sort of marrages when he gave the 10 commandments and the other legal details to Moses. By which time inter breeding and mutations meant there were real problems with such close marrages.

Where did the people come from? Either Cain and his wife had lots of children or other offspring of Adam and Eve followed Cain and helped him.

Note we are not given a time scale for Cains actions or for Abels, only that as grown men they worked, farming and brought offerings to God.

"The man referred to here is Christ the head of the body the woman is his bride the church."

No the man refered to is Adam the first man. Jesus is the second Adam. If he is the second Adam he cannot be the first Adam.
The women in genesis is not the church it is Eve Adam's bride and the mother of all humanity.

Israel does not appear for a few thousand years, what you are doing Dave is to spiritulise what is historical fact.

There is nothing wrong with doing that so long as you recognise the basic historical facts are just that historical facts and your spiritualising is your interprtation.

The first is totaly true your ideas are dependant on your correctly understanding thew bible.

So far you are taking verse out of context and twisting them to get them to say what they don't say, as per our posts on genesis

Offline davetaff

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Re: Do you believe in Evolution?
« Reply #55 on: May 17, 2019, 12:25:32 PM »
Hi John
Thank you for your reply you said
Quote

That is your opinion, set against what scripture says, that God created Adam from the dust of the ground.

What should you believe. scripture or your imagination     

Always believe the scripture they are always true so what do they say what did God say to Abram.

.16  And I will make thy seed as the dust of the earth: so that if a man can number the dust of the earth, then shall thy seed also be numbered         

And from the dust of the earth God created man Israel.

Quote
.   What does the devil say to Eve, ' Did God really say...'  Well what did God say that he did 

God said he would create man in his image male and female he created them this was achieved in Christ at his second coming.
A good place to see this is in Song of Songs.

Quote
.     
The old challenge.'Where did Cain get his wife?'
If Adam and Eve were the only humans, they would have had Children. Those children would marry brother to sister to produce more children who wqould find partners among there cousens etc       

Sorry John but there is nothing in scripture to support such a statement it's pure speculation and only leads to deformities.
Something I read a long time ago not sure if it's true that the minimum number required to create a safe gene pool is 8 the same number that was on the ark.

Quote
.
You are going Eeeew. God only forbad these sort of marrages when he gave the 10 commandments and the other legal details to Moses. By which time inter breeding and mutations meant there were real problems with such close marrages       

I think I have read that God does not change again you have no scriptural grounds you are only making things up to support your theology.

Quote
.
Where did the people come from? Either Cain and his wife had lots of children or other offspring of Adam and Eve followed Cain and helped him         

Again you have nothing in scripture to support this what does God's word say.

.  16  And Cain went out from the presence of the LORD, and dwelt in the land of Nod, on the east of Eden.

 17  And Cain knew his wife; and she conceived, and bare Enoch: and he builded a city, and called the name of the city, after the name of his son, Enoch     


That's it Cain when out from Eden and found a wife in the land of Nod there is nothing said about other children of Adam going there.
Quote
   
Note we are not given a time scale for Cains actions or for Abels, only that as grown men they worked, farming and brought offerings to God         

That's true there is another aspect to the story the elder brother kills the younger and if I'm right and Israel represents the elder brother who kills the younger brother which is Christ and we need to consider the history of Israel everything it's gone through its still here protected by God.

Quote
.   
No the man refered to is Adam the first man. Jesus is the second Adam. If he is the second Adam he cannot be the first Adam.
The women in genesis is not the church it is Eve Adam's bride and the mother of all humanity       

Israel is the first Adam created in God's image Christ is the last Adam who is the Image of god.

Quote
.
No the man refered to is Adam the first man. Jesus is the second Adam. If he is the second Adam he cannot be the first Adam.
The women in genesis is not the church it is Eve Adam's bride and the mother of all humanity     

I have never said Christ was the first Adam the first Adam is Israel the last Adam is Christ.
Israel's woman  Eve was the priesthood as the church is Christ's Eve.

Quote
.   
Israel does not appear for a few thousand years, what you are doing Dave is to spiritulise what is historical fact   

But we are living in the spiritual and like I have said before it will take God 6 days to create mankind in his image 6000 years.

Quote
     
So far you are taking verse out of context and twisting them to get them to say what they don't say, as per our posts on genesis

Everything I say is in the context of creation.

Love and Peace
Dave


 

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