Author Topic: Genesis and the OT  (Read 5934 times)

Description: Finding Christ in the OT

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TJ

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Re: Genesis and the OT
« Reply #184 on: June 29, 2016, 12:59:41 AM »
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in the same vain Adam did not agree to not eat of the tree of knowledge.

Hosea 6:7 As at Adam, they have broken the covenant; they were unfaithful to me there.

The Edenic covenant was a conditional covenant

TJ

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Re: Genesis and the OT
« Reply #185 on: June 29, 2016, 03:17:19 AM »
When I refer to the Torah, I'm referring to the laws and customs that were followed. I've already stated that the the historical importance is valid for understanding why the new covenant was necessary. People appear to constantly miss the point. Having the knowledge of genesis and the understanding of the 12 tribes will not bring you salvation or the spirit of truth. The foundations of your relationship with God are found in the New Testament, you have to bear your cross daily and live by the words of the Messiah. Your council, builder or foundation stone is in Christ, not genesis.

I find this interesting in that the scripture states  ; James 1:22 Do not merely listen to the word, and so deceive yourselves. Do what it says.

So @David St Ives ?

How do I observe God's word differently from the Jew ?

It is the same Word - after all ! or do I only read the New testament ?

Or do I only obey the current Rhema word ? [which can be deceiving]



Offline davetaff

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Re: Genesis and the OT
« Reply #186 on: June 29, 2016, 02:58:23 PM »


Hosea 6:7 As at Adam, they have broken the covenant; they were unfaithful to me there.

The Edenic covenant was a conditional covenant

Hi TJ
It seams we have a difference in translation  in the KJV it says

 Hos 6:7  But they like men have transgressed the covenant: there have they dealt treacherously against me.

Reading before and after this verse it is referring to Israel but i like Adam as well as I have said before I believe Adam is Israel or at least represents man in Gods image.

I believe it's time to put the thread back on track the brief was to find Christ in the OT not to argue about words and translations which are not very edifying to our Guests who may be reading the boards.

So with this in mind lets take our cue from our Lord.

Luk 24:25  Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken:
Luk 24:26  Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory?
Luk 24:27  And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto

Beginning at Moses I take that to mean the whole of the OT.

Love and Peace
Dave 

 

TJ

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Re: Genesis and the OT
« Reply #187 on: June 29, 2016, 04:25:19 PM »
sure, , back to the topic

Offline kim

Re: Genesis and the OT
« Reply #188 on: June 29, 2016, 07:36:42 PM »
Well said, let's get back to the much more exciting subject of finding Christ in the OT!

Here's a few bits I read recently which blessed me:

God always wanted to dwell with his people.  In the OT he gave very detailed instructions for the building of a special tent (tabernacle) which could be carried by the people on their journey to the Promised Land.  Because a holy God couldn't look on sin, he instructed the people to separate off the 'Most Holy Place' (where his presence would dwell) by erecting a huge veil. 

God gave specific details of how the 12 tribes of Israel should camp around the tabernacle when they stopped to rest.  If you work out how much space the camps would take up on each of the 4 sides of the tabernacle (quite easy to do, as the scripture records the numbers in each tribe) then - looking from above- the layout would have the shape of a cross.  So when God looked at his people he would see the cross, just as nowadays when he looks at us he doesn't see sinful people but he sees the cross of Jesus making us righteous. 

Also we now have access right into God's presence, because when Jesus died on the cross, the veil separating off the Most Holy Place was torn in two.  Wow!  And if it was people who tried to tear the veil in two, it would have been ripped it from bottom to top as it was so high - but this veil was ripped from top to bottom, ie by God.  Which speaks of the fact that we can never work our own way to God - it has to be through his work. He has provided a way for us to come to him.  Apparently the song "I Did It My Way" is one of the most popular songs for funerals - obviously not Christian funerals, as that is the complete opposite of what God wants. We should be singing "I did it God's way". 

Those who think they can do it their own way should read the history of God's people throughout the OT - time and time again they tried to do it their way but failed.  If salvation depended on our own work, we wouldn't stand a chance!!  So we should all read the OT, if only to remind us how easily we can get it wrong when we try to do it our way.  The OT history shows us why we need Jesus to pay the price for us, as well as foreshadowing how he would do that.  It's so rich and so mind-blowing, and I love it!

We don't need to take the blood of a slaughtered animal to cover our sin when we go into God's presence, as people had to in OT days, because we are covered in the blood of the eternal sacrifice of Jesus (the 'lamb' of God)- a finished work that doesn't have to be repeated over and over again as in the OT.

Every single detail of the tabernacle sheds light on the meaning of the sacrifice of Jesus.  No wonder that God instructed Moses (Ex 25:40) to make it exactly according to the pattern God showed him. It's all exciting stuff that thrills me and sends a shiver down my spine!  Moses couldn't have understood why all those small details were necessary, just as we often don't see the point of what God asks us to do, but he obeyed anyway and so should we!!

Over to others!
Blessings
Kim


Offline davetaff

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Re: Genesis and the OT
« Reply #189 on: June 30, 2016, 02:39:32 PM »
Hi Kim
Thanks for your post you made some very good points I liked the bit about the cross.
what more can we say about the tabernacle this verse from revelations may cast some light on the subject.

  Rev 21:2  And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
Rev 21:3  And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

Tabernacle can also mean body is the tabernacle of God Christ and his body the church in the centre of mankind as the earthly tabernacle was in the centre of Israel.
But the tabernacle Israel sat up is only a copy of the real thing.

2Co 5:1  For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.

That tabernacle is the body of Christ of which believers are a part   and have access to the father through the blood of Christ.

we should also be looking at the other attributes of our Lord he is Prophet priest and King so should we be looking in the OT for Christ in all these roles.

Love and Peace
Dave   

Offline davetaff

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Re: Genesis and the OT
« Reply #190 on: July 02, 2016, 02:25:11 PM »
Hi
So if we are looking for Christ in the OT should we be looking at the work he would do as Prophet Priest and King.
Moses was a Prophet he spoke the words of God  and God spoke to him telling him what to say how to build the tabernacle He gave them the Law everything he said came from God who followed them in  the  cloud by day and the fire by night so this was the prophets work to speak gods word to the People.
Like wise our Lord spoke the words the Father had given him.

Joh 14:10  Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.
Joh 17:8  For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.

So these verses prove that Christ is a Prophet because he speaks the words of the father not his own words as did the other prophets of the OT when they foretold of his coming.
So we see clearly that Christ is a prophet how do you think he fulfils these rolls can we see Christ in Aaron??

Love and Peace
Dave   

TJ

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Re: Genesis and the OT
« Reply #191 on: July 02, 2016, 02:42:51 PM »
Ahh - typology/anti types   :D

 Jeroboam turned away - so was he an antichrist ?