Author Topic: Genesis and the OT  (Read 5932 times)

Description: Finding Christ in the OT

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Offline kim

Re: Genesis and the OT
« Reply #144 on: June 26, 2016, 07:59:01 PM »
Hi TJ

I think our last messages "crossed in the post" (not sure what the internet version of that phrase is!). 

Not sure I understand this - Gen 7:14 was God addressing Abraham, so surely that's the Abrahamic covenant that he's saying can be broken by disobedience?  Any thoughts?

Hmmm ...
Bye for now
Kim

Offline kim

Re: Genesis and the OT
« Reply #145 on: June 26, 2016, 08:02:43 PM »
Hi TJ

Which covenant is the 'covenant of redemption'?  Where will I find it in the Bible?  (it's not under the cushion - I've just looked!)

Ta
Kim

TJ

  • Guest
Re: Genesis and the OT
« Reply #146 on: June 26, 2016, 11:07:50 PM »
I will reply shortly @kim


Offline David St Ives

Re: Genesis and the OT
« Reply #147 on: June 27, 2016, 12:26:59 AM »
The Torah illustrates the disobedience of man towards the old covenants that are obsolete. They are relevant because they help us to understand why the son of God was sent. They contain prophesies that were to be fulfilled, although again rejected by the very people they were meant for. Once rejected by the Jews, the fulfillment of the prophesies were directed towards the gentiles. They had a last chance effectively, but even to this day fail to accept that the messiah has come. The messiah had to be crucified for the scriptures to be fulfilled, the new covenant was born. When the messiah returned to the disciples, in body, to eat and drink, the truth was finally confirmed. The new tribes of Israel are the believers and those that walk in the light. The only way to the father is through the son. The people of the Torah had their chance, they rejected it. The new tribes, the new Jerusalem will be where the true believers are accepted. This will not be on this earth. The new Jerusalem has been built. It already exists. People need to learn to walk in the light through the basic principles laid out by the messiah. The holy spirit guides people, this requires faith, prayer and a sincere heart. Knowing the scriptures in a dogmatic, rote style to make points and counter arguments is what most people spend their time doing. The spirit and knowledge that follows is gained by faith and prayer, with an open heart, basic teachings from the messiah and a true love of man.

TJ

  • Guest
!
« Reply #148 on: June 27, 2016, 12:30:44 AM »
Well lets begin with the edenic covenant \? @kim  :-X

This was a conditional covenant eg : "Obey or disobey"

I can come up with lots of scriptures like = He has chosen you before the world was formed or "before the world was formed God chose yopu"

But lets go to the edenic covenant !

Lets look at this simple covenant [in which blood must be shed] and so Adam and Eve choose to  disobey" ?

So this is the end of humanity and somewhere - God made a mistake !

Now the Adamic covenant is the result of that mistake....

We all live by this ..

OKAY - you are now alive ATM -  and make a choice..................

You now live under the New Covenant..............  [I believe we are agreed on this ?]

So - we have this weird - eternal covenant - to come to terms with ?



Okay lets go back in tome to Adam and Eve and look at why God gave them skins  ? [re: Re: Genesis and the OT

Okay so this is the argument about "why is'nt the Trinity mentioned in the bible ?"

We never see the word "Trinity" ?

But we see see examples of "Trinity" mentioned all through the bilble ?"

So now we go the the adamic covenant - which is the result of Adams sin..

Incidentally we live under this covenant until we find Jesus..............

Suddenly we find Adam and including Eve were given skins to hide their  nakedness ?

Hoiw could this be ?

It was this weird covenant made before time |>?

It was between the Godhead  and we can call it the Trinity contract [if you like]

Or we can can call it "the Godhead union" or the "Trintiy agreement"  ?

Somehow Adam and Eve [without a covenant made between "God and man" was made outside of time or before time - "was made"

If it were not then we would not be here now



Or lets bsay "we would be - but  there would be n0 hope of "salvation" for us or Guest

In fact there would be no heaven or salvation for anyone...

I hope you understand this..[comprehend]

Thanks TJ






Offline David St Ives

Re: Genesis and the OT
« Reply #149 on: June 27, 2016, 12:37:11 AM »
I don't really understand what you're trying to say. It's simple. The old covenant is gone= Torah. Those who lived then would be judged by it. The new covenant= Y'ashuwa/Jesus is what we are now judged by. The almighty has changed the rules. It's simple.

TJ

  • Guest
Re: Genesis and the OT
« Reply #150 on: June 27, 2016, 12:40:46 AM »
So God [continued to make [regenerate] Adam and Eve His children

Genesis 3:21  he LORD God made garments of skin for Adam and his wife and clothed them.

So here there is redemption for Adam and Eve.

Yet they broke the covenant God still acted in Grace  ?



Now go even further between covenants and you see the eternal covenant at work

Hence people like Abraham were able to communicate with God


TJ

  • Guest
Re: Genesis and the OT
« Reply #151 on: June 27, 2016, 12:43:27 AM »
I don't really understand what you're trying to say. It's simple. The old covenant is gone= Torah. Those who lived then would be judged by it. The new covenant= Y'ashuwa/Jesus is what we are now judged by. The almighty has changed the rules. It's simple.

Hi @David St Ives

Hiow was Adam and Eve or Abraham made into new creations ?

Or do you belive that it only began @pentecost ?