Author Topic: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter  (Read 18452 times)

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Offline davetaff

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #536 on: October 19, 2016, 02:54:57 PM »
Hi Cariad
Thanks for your reply interesting I would jest like to ask you how do you picture the new Jerusalem I see it as all those who are taken up in the rapture descending in one great body Christ in them and they in Christ.

Love and Peace
Dave

Cariad

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #537 on: October 19, 2016, 09:56:02 PM »
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Cariad:
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Hi Dave (@davetaff)

Thank you for your question.

Regarding,' the Church which is His Body', our earthly origins are of no concern, are they? For we are all 'one' in Christ Jesus, 'in spirit', aren't we? We all come to God for salvation, through faith in His only begotton Son, and receive the seal of the Holy Spirit, which is the 'earnest' (or guarantee) of the future fulfillment of the gift of resurrection life which is in Christ Jesus. Our hope and sphere of blessing is in heavenly places, 'in Christ'.

Yet, Israel as a nation has promises yet to be fulfilled for them, which they will enter into in God's time, which pertains to the earth, and the Kingdom.

Yet again, out of Israel has/and will be called another company which is called 'the Bride of the Lamb', made up of those who were & will be, 'Overcomers,' in their generation, and, 'loved not their lives unto death'.  They, like Abraham, look for a city, 'which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God '(Heb 11:10 , 'a better country, that is, an heavenly:wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for He hath prepared for them a city.[/i]'(Heb 11:16).  That city being, 'The New Jerusalem', which will come down out of heaven to the earth.

'And there came unto me one of the seven angels
which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues,
and talked with me, saying,
"Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife."
And he carried me away
in the spirit
to a great and high mountain,
and shewed me that great city,
the holy Jerusalem,
descending out of heaven from God,"
(Rev 21:9,10)

So, God in His wisdom, has called separate companies of people, to inhabit different spheres, and perform different functions.  When those functions have fulfilled their purpose, and Christ has put all enemies under His feet, God being then 'all in all',  I believe the fact that we are typified as 'the Body of Christ' , and that there is a company called, 'the Bride of the Lamb' (Christ) is not without reason. 

*God knows, and His will, will be fully done, in His time, so I will not conjecture.
 
Thank you, Dave.
In Christ Jesus
Cariad
Hi Cariad
Thanks for your reply interesting I would jest like to ask you how do you picture the new Jerusalem I see it as all those who are taken up in the rapture descending in one great body Christ in them and they in Christ.

Love and Peace
Dave
Hi Dave,

When I read your post, and the question you ask within it, 'how do you picture the new Jerusalem,'  I thought immediately of verses which are so very moving  for me. Revelation 21:9-27, gives a wonderful description of the city itself doesn't it?  But, it is - Rev.7:16,17, which shows the sweetness, love and grace which will be there in that city, when those who have been faithful to the end will be cared for by the Lamb,

'They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more;
neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat.
For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them,
and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters:
and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.'

This just shows the love there will be between the Lamb and those who have been faithful unto death, who have withstood exposure, hunger, pain and death, rather than bear the mark of the beast or bowed down to worship him.  God Himself will wipe away all tears from their eyes. 

Praise God!

My understanding is imperfect, and I only just glimpse a minute pinhole glance at what will be a wonderful, wonderful uniting of the company of the faithful with their Lord.

* May God's perfect will be done, for His Name and glory's sake.

In Christ Jesus
Cariad




Offline davetaff

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #538 on: October 20, 2016, 02:49:45 PM »
Hi Cariad
Thanks for your post they certainly are wonderful scriptures you have posted and everyone who reads them will be edified.

the reason I said what I did about the new Jerusalem being the bride was because of the first verse of the scripture you quoted.

 Rev 21:9  And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.

The bride the angel showed John was the new Jerusalem the question is are all the things describing it symbolic of the Lords wife or is it a real building occupied by God Jesus and his church.
the other question would spiritual beings need a building to live in surely they would be free to roam free anywhere not confined to one place.

you said
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My understanding is imperfect, and I only just glimpse a minute pinhole glance at what will be a wonderful, wonderful uniting of the company of the faithful with their Lord.
   
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with this I can agree wholeheartedly.

Love and Peace
Dave 

Cariad

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #539 on: October 20, 2016, 08:05:20 PM »
Quote
@davetaff:
The bride the angel showed John was the new Jerusalem the question is, 
- are all the things describing it symbolic of the Lords wife or is it a real building occupied by God Jesus and his church.
the other question, 
- would spiritual beings need a building to live in surely they would be free to roam free anywhere not confined to one place.


Hi Dave, (@davetaff)

Quote
davetaff:
1.are all the things describing it symbolic of the Lords wife or is it a real building occupied by God Jesus and his church?
 

The words of chapter twentyone are described in verse 5 as, 'faithful' and 'true': therefore I want to honour them as such.  I do not dare to question the reality of the description of the Holy City. 'With God all things are possible'.

My ability to comprehend is limited by the finite nature of my mind and experience, as it is with all mankind: but God's ability must not be brought down to such limitations.  There is nothing impossible for the Creator of all things.

Praise God!

Quote
2. would spiritual beings need a building to live in surely they would be free to roam free anywhere not confined to one place.


Though 'spiritual', they will be like the Lord Jesus Christ in His resurrection, for He was and is, 'flesh and bones', he could be touched, eat drink, and talk and teach, He was not 'a' spirit.

Hope this is satisfactory, Dave.

Within the love of Christ our Saviour,
Cariad





 


 

Offline davetaff

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #540 on: October 21, 2016, 02:57:05 PM »
Hi Cariad
thanks for your reply and I understand fully your point of view maybe we can have a look at how the new Jerusalem was constructed.

Rev 21:18  And the building of the wall of it was of jasper: and the city was pure gold, like unto clear glass.
Rev 21:19  And the foundations of the wall of the city were garnished with all manner of precious stones. The first foundation was jasper; the second, sapphire; the third, a chalcedony; the fourth, an emerald;
Rev 21:20  The fifth, sardonyx; the sixth, sardius; the seventh, chrysolite; the eighth, beryl; the ninth, a topaz; the tenth, a chrysoprasus; the eleventh, a jacinth; the twelfth, an amethyst.

This reminds me of Aaron's dress in many ways when he carried the names of the 12 tribes on his shoulders and he had a golden sash it is reminiscent
of the new Jerusalem don't you think.

Exo 28:17  And thou shalt set in it settings of stones, even four rows of stones: the first row shall be a sardius, a topaz, and a carbuncle: this shall be the first row.
Exo 28:18  And the second row shall be an emerald, a sapphire, and a diamond.
Exo 28:19  And the third row a ligure, an agate, and an amethyst.
Exo 28:20  And the fourth row a beryl, and an onyx, and a jasper: they shall be set in gold in their inclosings.
Exo 28:21  And the stones shall be with the names of the children of Israel, twelve, according to their names, like the engravings of a signet; every one with his name shall they be according to the twelve tribes.

Love and Peace
Dave

Cariad

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #541 on: October 22, 2016, 11:27:21 AM »
Hi Cariad
thanks for your reply and I understand fully your point of view maybe we can have a look at how the new Jerusalem was constructed.

Rev 21:18  And the building of the wall of it was of jasper: and the city was pure gold, like unto clear glass.
Rev 21:19  And the foundations of the wall of the city were garnished with all manner of precious stones. The first foundation was jasper; the second, sapphire; the third, a chalcedony; the fourth, an emerald;
Rev 21:20  The fifth, sardonyx; the sixth, sardius; the seventh, chrysolite; the eighth, beryl; the ninth, a topaz; the tenth, a chrysoprasus; the eleventh, a jacinth; the twelfth, an amethyst.

This reminds me of Aaron's dress in many ways when he carried the names of the 12 tribes on his shoulders and he had a golden sash it is reminiscent
of the new Jerusalem don't you think.

Exo 28:17  And thou shalt set in it settings of stones, even four rows of stones: the first row shall be a sardius, a topaz, and a carbuncle: this shall be the first row.
Exo 28:18  And the second row shall be an emerald, a sapphire, and a diamond.
Exo 28:19  And the third row a ligure, an agate, and an amethyst.
Exo 28:20  And the fourth row a beryl, and an onyx, and a jasper: they shall be set in gold in their inclosings.
Exo 28:21  And the stones shall be with the names of the children of Israel, twelve, according to their names, like the engravings of a signet; every one with his name shall they be according to the twelve tribes.

Love and Peace
Dave

Hello Dave, (@davetaff)

In the wee small hours of the morning I lay awake, and thought about the content of your post (above), with the comparison Scriptures you have given from Exodus, and found my spirit praising God, because it brought to mind the wonderful knowledge that the Holy Spirit is our Teacher.  He Who formed us and gave us life in the flesh, knows the operation of our minds minutely,  He knows how to arrest our attention, and bring to our remembrance the things that we have learned through previous studies made, and combine them to illuminate the portions currently in view.

I particularly love this description from Exodus of the breastplate, which Aaron wore when he went in before the Lord, bringing graphically before God, remembrance of the twelve tribes by the precious stones, representative of them.  This breastplate was made to God's instruction, according to His design, specifically for this purpose.  Each stone, chosen with care. How great is our God!  How wonderful are His ways!

Yes, this is indeed obviously intended to be considered when reading the description of the Holy City. What is it then that the Holy Spirit wishes to convey to our minds by this comparison of Scripture with Scripture?  What does it tell us of the Holy City, 'the Bride of the Lamb', or of those who wil inhabit it?

In Christ Jesus
Cariad

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #542 on: October 22, 2016, 12:24:49 PM »
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Offline davetaff

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #543 on: October 22, 2016, 02:53:16 PM »
Hello Dave, (@davetaff)

In the wee small hours of the morning I lay awake, and thought about the content of your post (above), with the comparison Scriptures you have given from Exodus, and found my spirit praising God, because it brought to mind the wonderful knowledge that the Holy Spirit is our Teacher.  He Who formed us and gave us life in the flesh, knows the operation of our minds minutely,  He knows how to arrest our attention, and bring to our remembrance the things that we have learned through previous studies made, and combine them to illuminate the portions currently in view.

I particularly love this description from Exodus of the breastplate, which Aaron wore when he went in before the Lord, bringing graphically before God, remembrance of the twelve tribes by the precious stones, representative of them.  This breastplate was made to God's instruction, according to His design, specifically for this purpose.  Each stone, chosen with care. How great is our God!  How wonderful are His ways!

Yes, this is indeed obviously intended to be considered when reading the description of the Holy City. What is it then that the Holy Spirit wishes to convey to our minds by this comparison of Scripture with Scripture?  What does it tell us of the Holy City, 'the Bride of the Lamb', or of those who wil inhabit it?

In Christ Jesus
Cariad

Hi Cariad
Thank you for your post I hope I don't cause you to many sleepless nights we all need our beauty sleep :bedtime2:

back to the matter in hand I think we could dwell on this subject for some time I think we will need to consult the epistle to the Hebrews.
 My train of thought at the moment is Aaron was appointed as High priest in Israel his dress was very specific dictated by God and seams to be mirrored in the new Jerusalem.
Now we know we have a high priest who has entered into the holy of hollies and sits at the right hand of God and we know that he will return again to earth in glory.
Now as Aaron was clothed in his glorious raiment which are only shadows of things to come Our high priest Jesus Christ will come clothed with the realities all those chosen out of Israel and the Church.
Question, is the new Jerusalem the glorious return of our Lord.

Love and Peace
Dave