Author Topic: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter  (Read 18439 times)

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Serenity

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #456 on: September 06, 2016, 09:43:26 PM »
Hello @Serenity,

You began this thread.  If you would prefer that I do not enter so often here, with Dave being the only other participant, please let me know.  I just get carried away by the awesome nature of this book of books.

:)

Its totally up to people what posts they want to take part in Cariad, I no longer on the team here, please carry on as you feel led to. 

I don't overly participate in it, I more inquisitive or intrigued as to peoples viewpoints on it or takes on it, because it is a book on vision and dreams of an apostle. 

I think its a good exercise if anything to see what peoples interpretations are like of something, whereas it is biblical it is a direct spiritual output.  Its a good book of mixing the biblical word only approach to spirit led stuff.

Anyway getting confusing no doubt now, difficult to explain my mind at best and don't want to set it off course...so please carry on thanks. :D

Offline francis drake

Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #457 on: September 06, 2016, 11:03:19 PM »
Hi Cariad
Sorry to be a pain but I'm still thinking about the two witnesses what greater witnesses could there be than Israel and Christ the first and the last Adam

Rev 11:3  And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
Rev 11:4  These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

Clothed in sackcloth seams to me they will not be clothed in finery and we know Israel is likened to an Olive tree so why not the Christian Israel has had to pay a very high price for that witnessing and so have many Christians if they had not received power from above to endure they could never have carried on.
we need to see Israel not as a nation of many but as the first Adam of this creation and if you will accept it this man in Gods image he went wrong and was rejected but he is still a witness and will be redeemed with the blood of Christ the last Adam.

Love and Peace
Dave

These men cannot be Israel. If you continue in the passages you can see they are men who are sent to stand 1260 days in Jerusalem and then die and be resurrected.
You can hardly have the land of Israel standing in Jerusalem, which the last time I looked was standing in the middle of Israel, can you, let alone do the other things?

I suspect that one of them might be Elijah because he is prophecied to come just before the Messiah. He should have come before Jesus's first appearance, but John the Baptist came in the spirit of Elijah, I suspect because God knew Jesus would be rejected. Also Elijah would likely have been killed as John was.
Elijah did not die, so dying in Revelation makes sense.
Moses was full of vigour when he "died" his body was never found if I remember so he might have ascended like Elijah??
The other one is Enoch who didn't die.

Moses and Elijah appeared before Jesus..................?
Just musing!
Disturb us Lord, when we are too pleased with ourselves. When our dreams have come true because we dreamed too little. When we arrived safely because we sailed too close to the shore. Disturb us Lord, to dare more boldly. To venture on wider seas. Where storms will show your mastery; Where, losing sight of land, we shall find the stars. We ask you to push back the horizons of our hopes; And to push into the future, in strength, courage, hope and love.                     (SIR FRANCIS DRAKE 1577)

Online davetaff

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #458 on: September 07, 2016, 04:29:02 PM »
These men cannot be Israel. If you continue in the passages you can see they are men who are sent to stand 1260 days in Jerusalem and then die and be resurrected.
You can hardly have the land of Israel standing in Jerusalem, which the last time I looked was standing in the middle of Israel, can you, let alone do the other things?

I suspect that one of them might be Elijah because he is prophecied to come just before the Messiah. He should have come before Jesus's first appearance, but John the Baptist came in the spirit of Elijah, I suspect because God knew Jesus would be rejected. Also Elijah would likely have been killed as John was.
Elijah did not die, so dying in Revelation makes sense.
Moses was full of vigour when he "died" his body was never found if I remember so he might have ascended like Elijah??
The other one is Enoch who didn't die.

Moses and Elijah appeared before Jesus..................?
Just musing!

Hi Frances
Thank you for your input interesting I will need to think about it do you find it interesting that these important prophets seem to get  very little said about them as for Moses I think it says somewhere that nobody knows where he is buried which seems to indecate he was on the other hand he was with Christ at the transfiguration so it maybe his  earthly body died and was buried and he had received his heavenly body.

As for the two witnesses we now have Israel back in its own land and I believe one day they will accept Christ as there Savior then the Christian and the Jew will meet as brothers in Jerusalem this will be the witness it will last 3 1/2 years but the world will not accept it and by military force Jerusalem will be destroyed then the rapture of the faithful will take place.

Love and Peace
Dave       

Cariad

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #459 on: September 08, 2016, 10:53:41 AM »
Hi @davetaff, and @francis drake,

My kindle keeps trying to make me call you Falstaff, Dave! :)

* Regarding the transfiguration, our Lord Himself called it a vision.(Matthew 17:9). 
* Moses and Elijah were there with the transfigured Christ, in vision only.
* The vision was a word of prophecy in vision form of, 'the Son of Man coming in His Kingdom'(Matthew 16:28/ 2 Peter 1:18-21)
* Remember also John 3:13 and Deut. 34:5-7.

In Christ Jesus
Cariad

PS: Dave, Did you miss post #455?

Cariad

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #460 on: September 08, 2016, 11:38:12 AM »
'And the seventh angel sounded;
and there were great voices in heaven, saying,
"The kingdoms of this world
are become the kingdoms of our Lord,
and of His Christ;
and He shall reign for ever and ever. ... "

(Rev 11:15) 

-----------------------------------------

Hi there,
How wonderful these words are!
How long awaited this day?
How exciting it is, for all who wait for it, in heaven and on earth!
Yet, How Awesome, too.

:)

* This is the proclamation of the coming coronation of earth's rightful King (compare 2 Samuel 15:10; 1 Kings 1:39). 'Thy Kingdom come'! - Praise God!
* What a noisy place heaven was at that moment, with the sound of loud voices, and no wonder!!

* This is the last trumpet  sound in this series of seven (Rev.11:15), relative to this subject, but not the last absolutely.

* 1 Cor.15:51-52 speaks of 'the last trumpet: for a trumpet shall sound', and in 1 Thess. 4:16, we read that the Lord, 'shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the archangel's voice, and the trump of God.'  This is the 'last' Trumpet as regards one calling of God, but not (again) the last absolutely.  It will be sounded long before these judgments begin, in order to raise His sleeping saints, and take them up with the living saints, to be with Himself for ever.
 
* There will also be another great trumpet after the great Tribulation immediately connected with the Lord's revelation (Matt. 24:31), this is subsequent to this, 'seventh Trumpet,' for that revelation is recorded in Rev. 19.

Praise God!

:)

Cariad

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #461 on: September 08, 2016, 11:48:39 AM »
* What a statement this is!!  :)  Praise God!

'And the four and twenty elders,
which sat before God on their seats,
fell upon their faces,
and worshipped God,
Saying,
"We give thee thanks,
O Lord God Almighty,
which art, and wast, and art to come;
because Thou hast taken to Thee Thy great power,
and hast reigned.

And the nations were angry, and Thy wrath is come,
and the time of the dead, that they should be judged,
and that thou shouldest give reward unto Thy servants the prophets,
and to the saints,
and them that fear Thy Name,
small and great;
and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth."

(Rev 11:16-18) 



Online davetaff

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #462 on: September 08, 2016, 06:12:59 PM »
Hi @davetaff,

With respect, Adam as 'the first Man' goes back to the beginning, and the fall (Rom.5:12), beyond Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, so is not representative of Israel as a nation, but of mankind. Adam is a type, as the federal head of the newly created human race.

This is my first thought, but I hope to come back to this, Dave.

Thank you for giving me this line of enquiry.
In Christ Jesus
Cariad

:)

Hi Cariad
Sorry I did not reply I think maybe i am not explaining my self very well will try again.

When God destroyed everything with the flood He began a new creation think what the earth may have looked like during the flood the same as the beginning of Genesis a new beginning everything that God needed was on the ark all life forms.
Gods first command go forth and multiply which they did till there where many people which are likened to dust out of this dust God chooses Abraham we don't know why one man one egg it splits and devides  and is taken into the womb of Egypt it remained there until  it became full grown then God delivered Israel  through the waters of the Red sea "out of Egypt I called my Son".
Its the story of a normal pregnancy this is Gods creation of Man in his Image This is Adam this is Genesis 2.
Man in Gods Image is not one man think of what the last Adam will look like when he is complete with his bride Christ the head and millions of individuals as his body this is man in Gods image.

Love and Peace
Dave   

Cariad

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #463 on: September 09, 2016, 08:26:57 AM »
Thank you for your further explanation, @davetaff.

:)