Author Topic: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter  (Read 18424 times)

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Offline davetaff

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #448 on: September 05, 2016, 04:37:25 PM »
Hi Cariad
Jest thinking about the two witnesses if as you say they are two individuals men chosen by God what could they add to our knowledge of God I've always believed cannon of scripture ended with revelations and there was nothing else to add.

So I believe the witnesses are Israel and Christ and these are the first and the last Adam and as Paul tells us there will be a great falling away in the end times this represents the death of the two witnesses then they are taken up the rapture.

Love and Peace
Dave

Cariad

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #449 on: September 06, 2016, 08:26:21 AM »
Hi Cariad
Jest thinking about the two witnesses if as you say they are two individuals men chosen by God what could they add to our knowledge of God I've always believed cannon of scripture ended with revelations and there was nothing else to add.

So I believe the witnesses are Israel and Christ and these are the first and the last Adam and as Paul tells us there will be a great falling away in the end times this represents the death of the two witnesses then they are taken up the rapture.

Love and Peace
Dave

Hi Dave,

The Bible is the sum total of the revelation of God.  I agree.  Yet we are not told that the two witness have anything new to say, they are simply 'standing' during those 3 1/2 years as a witness for God, in the face of the onslaught of the Beast and all that is associated with him.  As a beacon for those who will resist the Beast, and a warning for those who will succumb to his influence.  They are given power to close the heavens so that it does not rain during that period, and so on, to manifest the power and presence of almighty God.

* To allegorize these events requires that you ignore many of the details surrounding these two individuals.  Yet, we are warned, aren't we, not to add or take away from this prophecy in Rev 22:18,19:-

'For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book,
If any man shall add unto these things,
God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:
And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy,
God shall take away his part out of the book of life,
and out of the holy city,
and from the things which are written in this book.'


Awesome words!

In Christ Jesus
Cariad



Cariad

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #450 on: September 06, 2016, 04:18:29 PM »
'And I beheld, and heard
an angel flying through the midst of heaven,
saying with a loud voice,
"Woe, woe, woe,"
to the inhabiters of the earth
by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels,
which are yet to sound!'

(Rev.8:13)
   
'One woe is past;
and, behold,
there come two woes more hereafter.'

(Rev.9:12)

'The second woe is past;
and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.'

(Rev 11:14) 
 
'Therefore rejoice, ye heavens,
and ye that dwell in them.
Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea!
for the devil is come down unto you,
having great wrath,
because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.'

(Rev.12:12) 

* This is the progression of the 'three woes' announced in Heaven, in Rev. 8:13.
Two have now passed, here in Revelation chapter 11, and the third is coming.

* The first is a warning to 'the inhabiters of the earth', in the third and last, it is to 'the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea'.

* The second woe (Rev.9:12) consists of two parts: 'The Horsemen', and 'The Two Witnesses'.
* The third woe, is the result of the sounding of the seventh Trumpet,  and occupies four chapters (Rev.15-18). Three chapters interrupt (Rev.12-14), taking is back (probably) to a time prior to chapter 4.and takes us on a different route to the same point, describing how the Wild Beast is to be revealed, and telling us the causes and consequences of his revelation.   

How complex this is!! Isn't it?

In Christ Jesus
Cariad

Cariad

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #451 on: September 06, 2016, 04:51:08 PM »
'And the seven angels
which had the seven trumpets
prepared themselves to sound.'

(Rev 8:6) 

- Four angel's  trumpets sounded in chapter 8. (Rev.8:7,8,10,12).
- the fifth and sixth angels trumpets sounded in Rev.9:1 & 9:13,
- the seventh in Rev. 11:15.

'And the seventh angel sounded;
and there were great voices in heaven, saying,
"The kingdoms of this world
are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of His Christ;
and He shall reign for ever and ever. ... "

(Rev 11:15) 

* What a sound there must be reverberating around heaven at this announcement.

Praise God!

Any thoughts?
In Christ Jesus
Cariad


Cariad

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #452 on: September 06, 2016, 05:23:38 PM »
Hello @Serenity,

You began this thread.  If you would prefer that I do not enter so often here, with Dave being the only other participant, please let me know.  I just get carried away by the awesome nature of this book of books.

:)


Offline davetaff

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #453 on: September 06, 2016, 05:28:40 PM »
Hi Cariad
Sorry to be a pain but I'm still thinking about the two witnesses what greater witnesses could there be than Israel and Christ the first and the last Adam

Rev 11:3  And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
Rev 11:4  These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

Clothed in sackcloth seams to me they will not be clothed in finery and we know Israel is likened to an Olive tree so why not the Christian Israel has had to pay a very high price for that witnessing and so have many Christians if they had not received power from above to endure they could never have carried on.
we need to see Israel not as a nation of many but as the first Adam of this creation and if you will accept it this man in Gods image he went wrong and was rejected but he is still a witness and will be redeemed with the blood of Christ the last Adam.

Love and Peace
Dave   

Cariad

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #454 on: September 06, 2016, 06:12:32 PM »
Hi Cariad
Sorry to be a pain but I'm still thinking about the two witnesses what greater witnesses could there be than Israel and Christ the first and the last Adam

Rev 11:3  And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
Rev 11:4  These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

Clothed in sackcloth seams to me they will not be clothed in finery and we know Israel is likened to an Olive tree so why not the Christian Israel has had to pay a very high price for that witnessing and so have many Christians if they had not received power from above to endure they could never have carried on.
we need to see Israel not as a nation of many but as the first Adam of this creation and if you will accept it this man in Gods image he went wrong and was rejected but he is still a witness and will be redeemed with the blood of Christ the last Adam.

Love and Peace
Dave

You are not a pain, @davetaff, :)
I will come back on this, God willing!

Within the love of Christ our Saviour,
Our Lord, and our Head.
Cariad

Cariad

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Re: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #455 on: September 06, 2016, 08:09:54 PM »
Hi Cariad
Sorry to be a pain but I'm still thinking about the two witnesses what greater witnesses could there be than Israel and Christ the first and the last Adam

Rev 11:3  And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
Rev 11:4  These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

Clothed in sackcloth seams to me they will not be clothed in finery and we know Israel is likened to an Olive tree so why not the Christian Israel has had to pay a very high price for that witnessing and so have many Christians if they had not received power from above to endure they could never have carried on.
we need to see Israel not as a nation of many but as the first Adam of this creation and if you will accept it this man in Gods image he went wrong and was rejected but he is still a witness and will be redeemed with the blood of Christ the last Adam.

Love and Peace
Dave

Hi @davetaff,

With respect, Adam as 'the first Man' goes back to the beginning, and the fall (Rom.5:12), beyond Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, so is not representative of Israel as a nation, but of mankind. Adam is a type, as the federal head of the newly created human race.

This is my first thought, but I hope to come back to this, Dave.

Thank you for giving me this line of enquiry.
In Christ Jesus
Cariad

:)