Author Topic: Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter  (Read 18412 times)

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Offline Seeker

Re: Book of Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #16 on: December 16, 2015, 08:37:13 AM »
On P.142 of the above mentioned book, the author states; 'It is better to see the book as describing what will happen in the whole of 'the last days' between the ascension of Christ and his second coming' (this is in reference to the book of Revelations). The author goes on to say 'So, for example, the four horsemen have been active, and will be active, throughout the last days. They represent the imperialistic, aggression, bloodshed, economic instability and death that will mark every age until Christ returns. Christians will have to hold firmly to the vision of the throne in heaven if they are to persevere through such hardships. And we shall need to remind ourselves that they will not go on for ever. The last few chapters of the book take us to the end time when Jesus will destroy evil and establish the perfect new creation.'

Also the author states; 'God cannot introduce the new creation he has promised until all that spoils the old one has been removed.'

On P.143 in regards to why various systems have not worked and various ideas of Utopia have failed the author states;

'That is because they have not dealt with the root of the problem. Ultimately, it is not capitalism, ignorance or wicked government that spoils life on earth; it is, rather, the power of evil, originating from Satan himself.'

(Continued in next post...)


Offline Seeker

Re: Book of Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #17 on: December 16, 2015, 09:04:01 AM »
Okay, onwards and upwards - the reference for the book I quoting from is in my first post. I know I posting a fair bit, but it is in the hopes that it might be useful for someone else, plus I will get onto my ponderings in due course :D. I might have mentioned else where - I'm a prolific note taker  :wink:.

P.143 Under the section 'The fall of Babylon', the author states 'She represents non- Christian society organized without reference to God: 'the world'. '

That is in reference to 'Babylon'. Is this a general consensus? Is this what most Christians believe?

P.144 ' "The beast" (who represents worldly anti-Christian powers), 'the false prophet' (worldly anti-Christian ideology) and Satan are also judged alongside Babylon.'

Again - is this general Christian consensus/belief?

Also;

'All those whose names are not in the book of life are thrown into the lake of fire, which represents eternal death, separation from God (20:15).'

Okay, my question is, the author says 'represents', so does that mean there is not a literal 'lake of fire'? What is meant by 'eternal death'?, does that mean being dead forever, never a chance to come back? Do the dead know they are dead? I pondering aloud here, as this raises lots of questions for me. Is it referring to spiritual death?

Author goes on to say; 'All those who refuse to acknowledge Christ's rule must be excluded;...'

So does this mean they go on in some form of existence though?

Author also says; 'Justice is done and evil is destroyed.'

Okay, well that is obviously good - are people evil though? The Bible says we don't wage war against 'flesh and blood', so is it jus the evil working through people that is destroyed, or the people too?

Okay, will leave it here for now and continue in another post - this one has enough ponderings in it.

Offline Seeker

Re: Book of Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #18 on: December 16, 2015, 09:34:06 AM »
Alright, some more confusing bits (to me). I do understand that I can't understand everything, but doesn't stop me trying :D, especially if something piques my interest.

Right, the bit in Revelations, where it talks about Satan being seized for a thousand years - the author of the book I referenced (see my first post) says this is not to be taken literally, that a thousand years is meant to be 'a long time'. At the end of a millennium Satan released and gathers powers to do battle with God? (I find this confusing).

On P.145 the author states 'The millennium represents the whole of the last days, we are in it now'. He goes onto say that is his (the authors view) and that Satan has '...already being defeated and bound...' but that Satan is still active, but can do nothing to thwart God's purposes.

So again, is this a popular Christian belief? and also does this mean Satan is still yet to be released?

Just one other pondering, that I do wonder about, in book of Revelations foreheads and marks on such are referred to - is this something symbolic? It did get me wondering, due to the business of some believing the third eye thing is on the forehead, also I notice when some do the 'slain in the Spirit' thing, they also touch people on the forehead. I just wonder if there is some importance with the forehead?, I know some beliefs say that is where people's spirits come out and stuff like that - so has got me pondering.

Well I did have other notes, but I feel I have posted enough for the moment - so will leave it there for now.

TJ

  • Guest
Re: Book of Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #19 on: December 16, 2015, 12:14:08 PM »
anyone ?

Online Mountain Goat

Re: Book of Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #20 on: December 16, 2015, 05:50:53 PM »
The forehead is important as it is reserved for God.
Regarding the 1000 years. It has to be literally 1000 years. If it were not then the Bible would be a lie and we'd easily be able to explain away everything to mean something else.
.

TJ

  • Guest
Re: Book of Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #21 on: December 17, 2015, 12:47:01 AM »
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The forehead is important as it is reserved for God.
Regarding the 1000 years. It has to be literally 1000 years. If it were not then the Bible would be a lie and we'd easily be able to explain away everything to mean something else.

 
It has to be literally 1000 years


referring to  Posted by: Seeker
? on: Yesterday at 09:34:06 AM
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Right, the bit in Revelations, where it talks about Satan being seized for a thousand years - the author of the book I referenced (see my first post) says this is not to be taken literally, that a thousand years is meant to be 'a long time' - See more at: http://www.1faith.co.uk/bible-buddies/book-of-revelation-discussion-chapter-by-chapter/16/?action=post;quote=52221;last_msg=52221#sthash.FkI2S1Io.dpuf

We see many metaphors/symbols/types/ and not to mention times or time in scripture !

The day of days being the day of rest - extending out through time to all who may want to enter it/Him

Days of creation extending out into the "Now" where God creates a new creature 2 Corinthians 5:17;

Where God speaks "let there be Light" into a persons life.

And the most quoted verse that states "a day is like a thousand years" Psalm 90:4 - 2 Peter 3:8

The bible is full of incomplete books -  incomplete in that we will never fully comprehend the "written word" - let alone God/Jesus.

It is a lie in the sense that all is not disclosed - as in the same way I can lie by remaining quiet - but this is God's "hidden will"

God's sovereign will does not dictate that everything that happens is of God -  however it means that God has allowed a situation "although the purposes of the situation are hidden" and may be or may not be revealed to us.






http://www.1faith.co.uk/bible-buddies/book-of-revelation-discussion-chapter-by-chapter/16/?action=post;quote=52221;last_msg=52221#sthash.FkI2S1Io.dpuf
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TJ

  • Guest
Re: Book of Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #22 on: December 17, 2015, 12:52:57 AM »
Now lets expand the borders of our tent and stretch the mindset..

Let me suggest that "when God allows something to happen it is "within His will" even if it is in or within His "permissive will"


TJ

  • Guest
Re: Book of Revelation discussion, chapter by chapter
« Reply #23 on: December 17, 2015, 12:55:11 AM »
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Seeker
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Just one other pondering, that I do wonder about, in book of Revelations foreheads and marks on such are referred to - See more at: http://www.1faith.co.uk/bible-buddies/book-of-revelation-discussion-chapter-by-chapter/new/#new

I believe it is to do with "who is the Head of your life"



http://www.1faith.co.uk/bible-buddies/book-of-revelation-discussion-chapter-by-chapter/new/#new