Author Topic: The Myth of saying that God Loved all men in the world without exception !  (Read 7299 times)

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Offline Primrose

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Re: The Myth of saying that God Loved all men in the world without exception !
« Reply #48 on: November 15, 2021, 12:16:59 PM »
Before the creation of the world God planned for His son Jesus to be born Jewish and through Israel.

"His own" are Israel in relation  to Jesus being  in human form, being born in the flesh.

Some of Israel followed Jesus and others didn't.

Some of Israel claimed to be God's people but their hearts were far from Him, not being circumcised by the heart and they didn't follow Jesus .

Although they were part of Israel they were against God.

Jesus referred to them as children of the devil.

Yet Jesus was crucified and  through their rejection,  the rest of the world was enabled to be children of God. Not through natural descent and the  deeds of  the flesh , but of power. That those who made a heart response to Him in their spirit became born again.

Through the power of the Holy Spirit.

As in a nutshell explained by the parable of the sower, where seed was scattered in different places and the seed on good soil grew.

That represents the Holy Spirit in the work of God directly;  and through the fruits of the Holy Spirit in the work of God through His people. Also the work of God directly through the Word of God and indirectly through people, such as in the gospel and speech and words seasoned with salt.

To some it's the fragrance of death and to others the fragrance of life. Not on fleshy surface layers but in the core of the soul.

John 1:11-13

11  He came unto his own, and his own received him not.

12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

Offline davetaff

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Re: The Myth of saying that God Loved all men in the world without exception !
« Reply #49 on: November 15, 2021, 12:49:49 PM »
Hi Primrose
Thank you for an interesting post a good read the God of the bible is the God of Love and he Loves us saint and sinner alike and his purpose is to destroy evil and his weapon of choice is

   and take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God,
Ephesians 6:17 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/eph.6.17.ESV       


Yes it is the word of God that will destroy evil.

Love and Peace
Dave
https://bible.com/bible/59/eph.6.17.ESV

Offline brightfame52

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Re: The Myth of saying that God Loved all men in the world without exception !
« Reply #50 on: November 15, 2021, 03:01:31 PM »

Heb 12:6-10

Heb 12:6-10

6For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.

7If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?

8But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.

9Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?

10For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness.

Since the writer seems to indicate that some can be without chastisement, of which all them that God Loveth [see Rev 3:19] receives, then its reasonable to conclude that those who be without it, The Lord did not Love, and they are bastards as scripture says, and not son's [This destroys the ungodly concept that all mankind are the son's of God] For if all were sons of God, this inspired statement by the writer of Hebrews is a lie.

Jesus says in Rev 3:19 " as many as He Loves" He Chastens ! Why if He loved all mankind without exception, then His statement " as many as " is misleading and tends to deceive, why even say it that way Lord Jesus, if you Love all mankind without exception.

The phrase " as many as" is a idiom denoting a part as distinct from the whole ! Dividing something into parts.

It can denote a large number, but not all. One can be told to take as many as you like, but that does not mean to take all.

So this very Phrase, As Many as I Love, denotes that Christ does not Love all mankind without exception !

Offline brightfame52

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Re: The Myth of saying that God Loved all men in the world without exception !
« Reply #51 on: November 15, 2021, 03:17:22 PM »
Hi Brightfame52
Jest a thought.

    Luk 5:32 I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance

   Mat 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you     


So dose this apply to God dose he love his enemy satan and his children?

Love and Peace
Dave

Again Dave, this isnt about what God commands. This is about who God loves. Also I think its not wise to answer a question, or even ask one about something applying to God as though Hes a creature like you and i.  The psalms reads Ps 50:21

These things hast thou done, and I kept silence; thou thoughtest that I was altogether such an one as thyself: but I will reprove thee, and set them in order before thine eyes.

Dave God is above us, He can command us not to kill, but He has the right to kill, when we dont. 1 Sam 2:6


The Lord killeth, and maketh alive: he bringeth down to the grave, and bringeth up.

Now God killing He  hasnt broken any commandment, but if we kill we have.

Offline Primrose

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Re: The Myth of saying that God Loved all men in the world without exception !
« Reply #52 on: November 15, 2021, 07:40:38 PM »
The Lord disciplines those who have the benefits of His love, in the spiritual family.

That doesn't mean that those outside of the family of God are not loved. They haven't yet been born again and obtained kinship.

Think of a good family. The children have the benefits of the love but that doesn't mean others outside of the family are not loved.

How are people supposed to be comforted if they are not loved and told they are only loved by God, if they are chosen by Him.

It makes the world a cold place with no love from heaven and not from anywhere.

Without love it makes the world dark but that's not true there is a Light shining in the darkness, in the Light of Christ.

You only have to see the beauty and wonder of creation to see His love in His divine attributes.
That humankind spoilt by choosing the dark over the light of God.

Offline brightfame52

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Re: The Myth of saying that God Loved all men in the world without exception !
« Reply #53 on: November 16, 2021, 11:03:26 AM »
His Great Love quickens the Dead !

I know that God does not Love everyone without exception because everyone without exception is not and will not be quickened because of His Great Love. Eph 2:4-5

4But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,

5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved )

God performed this deed for those He Loved while they were dead in sins. Not when they repented or when they came in Faith, but even while dead. In fact coming in repentance and faith are direct results of having been quickened or made alive.

The psalmist wrote once this Ps 80:18

18So will not we go back from thee: quicken us, and we will call upon thy name.

The calling upon the name of the Lord follows the quickening..

God's Love to those He Loves is not just a mere emotion, but it is also application. God's Love gives Life [spiritual] to dead sinners.

This was Illustrated with Jesus and the story of Lazarus See Jn 11:3,36

Lazarus was one for scripture says Jesus loved " behold, how He loved him"

Christ love was demonstrated by quickening Lazarus from the dead.

God nor Christ's Love could be of no lesser degree of that which they command of their followers. 1 Jn 3:16-18

16Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.

17But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?

18My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.

Let us Love in deed. The word deed is the same word in the greek for work, its the word ergon and it means doing !

James using the almost same identical situation adds this James 2:


15If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,

16And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?

Does not God's Love give those He Loves what is needful for their souls.

God's Love gives those He loves, and sees them dead in trespasses and sins, He is mover with compassion and gives them life from the dead. Love expresses itself in deed to the brethren.

Now are not those Christ died for considered His brethren ? Heb 2:11,17

11For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren,


17Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

Where they not His Brethren before they believed in Him ? Yes they were, thats why He was made like unto them to deliver them from their spiritual ruin and enmity against God.

Was He not the Firstborn of many Brethren who had not yet been born sinners ? Rom 8:29

29For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

If Christ sees one of His Brethren dead in trespasses and sins, and He has all Power in His Hands, will He suffer His Brethren, whom for sure He Loves, to remain helpless in that dead state ? Cannot and will He not quicken whomsoever He wills? Jn 5:21

21For as the Father raiseth up the dead, and quickeneth them; even so the Son quickeneth whom he will. Certainly He will s to quicken those He Loves, He laid His life down for them. Jn 15:13

Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

Scripture says that He died for them while they were yet enemies, and in spite of that, by His death He reconciled them to God, and those so reconciled [even while dead in sin and enemies] Shall be saved[Experientially] by His Life. That says it all.

It can read Shall be quickened by His Life, made alive. So, those who die in their sins, dead to God, alienated from Him, God did not Love them, nor did Christ Love them and Lay down His Life for them, if He did ,He would have quickened them, made them alive, saved them. Eph 2:5

5Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)

Ye see that ? The quickening results in being saved by Grace.

Offline davetaff

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Re: The Myth of saying that God Loved all men in the world without exception !
« Reply #54 on: November 16, 2021, 12:55:39 PM »
Hi Brightfame52
Thank you for you post and scriptures to which I can agree scriptures are always correct its mans interpretation that can be wrong and this is what we are discussing you are saying only those who are chosen will be saved and I agree they will be then we have the rest of humanity they have not been chosen by God but God has given them the opportunity to be saved by the preaching of the gospel and repenting of their sins and belief in Jesus Christ  can inherit eternal life.
We can see this in Israel Aaron the high priest represents Christ the tribe of Levi represents the bride of Christ the other 11 tribes are the children who need instruction

     for at one time you were darkness, but now you are light in the Lord. Walk as children of light
Ephesians 5:8 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/eph.5.8.ESV

   Therefore be imitators of God, as beloved children.
Ephesians 5:1 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/eph.5.1.ESV

     In return (I speak as to children) widen your hearts also.
2 Corinthians 6:13 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/2co.6.13.ESV

        As obedient children, do not be conformed to the passions of your former ignorance,
1 Peter 1:14 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/1pe.1.14.ESV

  I do not write these things to make you ashamed, but to admonish you as my beloved children.
1 Corinthians 4:14 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/1co.4.14.ESV       
     


So we who believe are children of Christ and his bride and will enter into the millennium with him to recieve further instruction.

Love and Peace
Dave

https://bible.com/bible/59/eph.5.8.ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/eph.5.1.ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/2co.6.13.ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/1pe.1.14.ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/1co.4.14.ESV

Offline brightfame52

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Re: The Myth of saying that God Loved all men in the world without exception !
« Reply #55 on: November 17, 2021, 11:31:32 AM »
Jer 31:3


Jer 31:3

3The LORD hath appeared of old unto me, saying, Yea, I have loved thee with an everlasting love: therefore with lovingkindness have I drawn thee.

Those whom God Loves He Loves them with an everlasting Love, centered in Jesus Christ whom He Loved with an Everlasting Love Jn 17:23-24

23I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

24Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.

For God could never tell any Being He Loved them with an everlasting Love apart from Christ Rom 8:39

39Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

And since this True, He draws all so Loved to Himself. He does this by putting His Spirit in them.

The word lovingkindness is the word checed and can mean Faithfulness or mercy. Its translated mercy 149 times in the OT

The word drawn denotes the efficaciousness of His Grace.

This refers to the Church, which at that time was mostly confined to the jews, and this Love and Faithfulness is due to the Everlasting Covenant or the New Covenant. Later in the same Chapter we have this : Jer 31:31-34

31Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:

33But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.43

34And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

The Fruit and Effect of God's Love will always draw individuals to Christ, to find their Life in Him , which Life they had in Him as His Seed, being Chosen in Him before the foundation.

 

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