Author Topic: Denominations  (Read 845 times)

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Offline melliff

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Re: Denominations
« Reply #8 on: February 20, 2021, 04:44:45 PM »

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Deborah
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but most churches and Christians of different denominations work happily together.
.  Try telling that to the thousands of Roman Catholoic and Protestant martyrs who died horrible deaths for their interpretation of God's word.  They believed that they were dying for 'the truth'.
And "work happily together" ignores fundamanental differences in doctrine. Some denominations believe that Genesis is literally true, while others believe it is allegorical.  Surely it is important that we know the truth, because it has far reaching consequences.  Some denominations believe in a literal Hell, while others do not.  Should we not know the truth?

TJ's
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I would avoid places that might lead you into the wrong things, such as spiritualist churches or the mormon belief
  Who is to say that these churches are into "the wrong things"?  The believe in their interpretation as deeply as you do in yours.

Davetaff 
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check everything that different denominations say is to check it against what the scripture say against what they say if what they say contradicts scripture then you can disregard what they say.
But scripture is interpretation.  It is human being's interpretation of God's word and has often gone through several translations and interpretations. Who is to say that scripture is correct?  When you read scripture, you interpret it for yourself.  If someone interprets it differently who is to say that it is wrong.

This is the point of my question. The thousands of denominatiions show that God's word can be interpreted in thousands of different ways.  How are we to know the truth?

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Offline eik

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Re: Denominations
« Reply #9 on: February 20, 2021, 08:38:34 PM »



What on earth are you talking about ?


O dear ....
You haven't noticed that Paul uses the term "Church of God" to refer to the true apostolic church? Too bad.

This is evidently to distinguish the true church from false churches not deemed to be "churches of God."

Offline Deborah

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Re: Denominations
« Reply #10 on: February 20, 2021, 09:26:59 PM »
Deborah .  Try telling that to the thousands of Roman Catholoic and Protestant martyrs who died horrible deaths for their interpretation of God's word.  They believed that they were dying for 'the truth'.
That was the case 400-500 years ago, when the splits were raw and tempers were hot. As you point out, there were martyrs on both sides and neither comes out with much credit. Now we no longer kill each other on the grounds of our disagreements - and to talk as if we were all still at each others throats is seriously misleading. Do you really think the martyrs mind that the persecutions have stopped? They're probably relieved! It's their murderers who will be embarrassed that it was all for nothing.

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And "work happily together" ignores fundamanental differences in doctrine. Some denominations believe that Genesis is literally true, while others believe it is allegorical.  Surely it is important that we know the truth, because it has far reaching consequences.  Some denominations believe in a literal Hell, while others do not.  Should we not know the truth?
Believing in a literal interpretation of Genesis or a literal Hell are not denominational issues that I am aware of - these things cut right across denominations. Go to any church and do a survey on the relationship between Genesis and evolution, and I bet you'll get a dozen different answers.
Important to know the truth, but bear in mind that:
1) Not all truths are equally important (the Trinity is major truth, but not the precise mode of baptism, how Communion should be served, or the date of Easter)
2) Not all doctrines are unambiguous in Scripture (there is room for debate on several issues, such as whether Hell is annihilation or eternal punishment
3) We are saved by faith in Christ, not by believing all the "right" doctrines

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This is the point of my question. The thousands of denominatiions show that God's word can be interpreted in thousands of different ways.  How are we to know the truth?

If it was so important to have a single interpretation of God's word, presumably He would have given it to us in a different form. Some of the ambiguities are probably deliberate (e.g. when Christ will return). I think one thing we can be sure of is to avoid any denomination that claims to be the only possessor of truth! We can't avoid having opinions and making choices, but we should be humble enough to acknowledge that we might be wrong.
"Resist the devil, standing firm in the faith." (I Peter 5:9)

Offline eik

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Re: Denominations
« Reply #11 on: February 21, 2021, 05:16:53 AM »
The thousands of denominatiions show that God's word can be interpreted in thousands of different ways.  How are we to know the truth?
Obvious non sequitur. Multiple denominations do not reflect multiple individual "interpretations" of scripture. The most obvious factors in the spread of denominationalism are (a) history, which derives from church politics down the ages, and (b) geography.

Contrariwise even within a single usually liberal denomination there can be wide variations in belief and practice.

Politics and geography alone don't infer "God's word can be interpreted in thousands of different ways."

Moreover frequently it is not interpretation, but application that is the issue. People can often agree what the bible says and what it means, but simply refuse to apply it because they don't have the faith to apply it, or because they believe the leadship allows them not to.  Often denominations are just about leadership issues. As Paul says, men will arise and draw people after them in a conscionable sort of way. Some church leaders seek large congregations personally committed to them, because of the kudos it gives them, not to mention wealth. Hence the mega-church, which seems ridiculous when seen from the point of view of the NT model of mutual participation, but doubtless serves vested interests beneficial to the leadership.

Offline davetaff

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Re: Denominations
« Reply #12 on: February 21, 2021, 11:28:10 AM »
Hi Melliff
Thank you for your reply you said

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    But scripture is interpretation.  It is human being's interpretation of God's word and has often gone through several translations and interpretations. Who is to say that scripture is correct?  When you read scripture, you interpret it for yourself.  If someone interprets it differently who is to say that it is wrong.

This is the point of my question. The thousands of denominatiions show that God's word can be interpreted in thousands of different ways.  How are we to know the truth?       

All I can give you is how I solved this question for my self after spending quite a bit of money on books about Christianity I was in the same quandary as you.
Who was right all of them or none of them there seamed to be differences of opinion everywhere I looked.
So one day I put all these books aside and said to myself how dose Gods word speak to my so I picked up my bible and read it from cover to cover genealogies and all and have never looked back.
You ask where do we find the truth the answer is in the word of God for myself I use ths KJV because I have reasoned  that the God of all creation would have no difficulty in producing a book as he wanted it to be yes a man held the pen but God dictated what he wrote.
I cannot  believe that the God of all creation would allow a mere man to interfere with his word we have to trust God and adhere to his word all man made doctoring and theology if they are not found in scripture should be discarded we need to get back to basics the word of God not the word of man.

Love and Peace
Dave

Offline eik

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Re: Denominations
« Reply #13 on: February 21, 2021, 12:41:52 PM »
Who is to say that these churches are into "the wrong things"?  The believe in their interpretation as deeply as you do in yours.
1 John 5:7,8 "For there are three that testify: the Spirit, the water and the blood; and the three are in agreement."

These three are tokens: Spirit is what believers are given by God, but spirit also denotes the word of God that comes from the Spirit, the divine nature and the testimony of Jesus; the water denotes purification, baptism, the pledge of a clear conscience toward God and the resurrection of Jesus Christ in the flesh. 1 Pet 3:21, the blood refers to the blood of Jesus shed for sins, justification of humanity, the removal of guilt from sin, the piercing of the veil and entry into the holy place.

You ask, who is to judge wrong? Anyone possessing the above tokens of righteousness and whom can show or demonstrate by these tokens that another is in error.

For it is not the pretext or claim to belief alone that provides legitimacy. "Belief" in satan and in error can be very profound and impossible to break. Captivity to sin is long-lived and intense. Every cultist is devoted to their cult.

Right and wrong is perceived in the extent of one's reception of the God-given tokens. The refusal to accept what is written in the New Testament is the undoing of many unfaithful churches, like Sardis. They have big reputations but little obedience. They will not conform to the Spirit. They refuse to do what is right. Mostly their errors are obvious and derive from the need of the leadership to maintain the greatest possible numbers in their congregations for financial reasons. Often this is seen in churches orientated towards humanist politics.

E.g refusal by church leaders of the injunction for women to have their heads covered in the name of politics or culture, but really to maintain church numbers and incomes.




Offline Serenity

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Re: Denominations
« Reply #14 on: February 22, 2021, 02:05:23 AM »
To know the Lord is to lose the earth.
The Scriptures are more than words, they are the 'literal' key to God's Spiritual Kingdom.
Do not make the Bible an idol and locked door in your journey with God.
Do not kill the Bible by keeping to the letter and not the Spirit of it.
It is a spiritual work, not a fictional one.
One kills...the other leads to light, love, life and freedom.
Words have the power of life and death, not just the ones that roll off the tongue!
🔥💖GOD CAN USE ANYTHING, ANYWHERE, ANYTIME, ANYONE, ANYHOW, FOR HIS GOOD AND PURPOSE 💖🔥

Offline melliff

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Re: Denominations
« Reply #15 on: February 22, 2021, 07:04:16 AM »
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I cannot  believe that the God of all creation would allow a mere man to interfere with his word we have to trust God and adhere to his word all man made doctoring and theology if they are not found in scripture should be discarded we need to get back to basics the word of God not the word of man.

One would think not, but take the commandment "Thou shalt not kill."  One can't get more "back to basics" than that.  It seems an absolutely unambiguous statement; but look at different versions of the Bible and you see it also gets translated as "Thou shalt not murder", which of course leaves the door open for many denominations to send their members to kill and be slaughtered in wars, whereas some denominations take the original meaning literally and are pacifists.  Who has the truth?  Presumably God does and he must have known that his word was going to be misinterpreted, so if he meant "Those shalt not kill", why didn't he add "under any circumstances"?  Did he want the commandment to be open to interpretation?

If such a basic statement in the Bible is open to such different interpretation, how can we trust that any version of the Bible contains God's word as he intended it?

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