Author Topic: Genesis  (Read 4400 times)

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Offline Cariad

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Re: Genesis
« Reply #88 on: August 05, 2020, 04:04:58 PM »
'A river flowed out of Eden to water the garden,
and there it divided and became four rivers.
The name of the first is the Pishon.
.. It is the one that flowed around the whole land of Havilah,
.... where there is gold.
...... And the gold of that land is good;
........ bdellium and onyx stone are there.
The name of the second river is the Gihon.
.. It is the one that flowed around the whole land of Cush.
And the name of the third river is the Tigris,
.. which flows east of Assyria.
And the fourth river is the Euphrates.
.. The LORD God took the man
.... and put him in the garden of Eden to work it and keep it. '     
   
(Gen 2:10-15) 

Hi Dave,

Moses wrote this book of Genesis, his was the pen, but God was the Author.  These are facts, concerning the rivers that flowed through and watered Eden: with lovely little descriptions of the lands they pass through or around.  Moses is writing this retrospectively, so speaks in terms of lands which at the time referred to were not populated by either the offspring of Cush, or the Assyrians: but these facts are added in the light of subsequent knowledge.

Adam was quite able to deal with all that was given to him to do.  He had no weeds to inhibit him, the ground was not yet cursed, so it would have yielded it's produce wonderfully.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris


Offline davetaff

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Re: Genesis
« Reply #89 on: August 06, 2020, 01:48:59 PM »
Hi
Next section

    And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, ?You may surely eat of every tree of the garden, but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die.?
Genesis 2:16-‬17 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/gen.2.16-17.ESV       


Up to this point there is no woman helper which is a little strange the man is commanded to not eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil.
So who or what is the tree of knowledge we know Israel is depicted  as an olive tree St paul confirms this.

       For if you were cut from what is by nature a wild olive tree, and grafted, contrary to nature, into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, the natural branches, be grafted back into their own olive tree.
Romans 11:24 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/rom.11.24.ESV       


So Israel is seen as an olive tree only Israel had the law witch told them what good and evil is so Israel is the tree of knowledge so the man in genesis 2 is our lord at his first comming he is being told by the Father to not join in israels disobedience the woman who is to be created later is the Church.

Love and Peace
Dave

https://bible.com/bible/59/gen.2.16-17.ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/rom.11.24.ESV

Offline Cariad

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Re: Genesis
« Reply #90 on: August 07, 2020, 03:55:38 PM »
Hi
Next section

    And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, ?You may surely eat of every tree of the garden, but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die.?
Genesis 2:16-‬17 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/gen.2.16-17.ESV       


Up to this point there is no woman helper which is a little strange the man is commanded to not eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil.
So who or what is the tree of knowledge we know Israel is depicted  as an olive tree St paul confirms this.
'And the LORD God commanded the man, saying,
Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil,
thou shalt not eat of it:
for in the day that thou eatest thereof
thou shalt surely die.'

(Genesis 2:16-17)

Hello Dave,

No, God had not yet created a help-meet for Adam.  God had not yet created the beasts of the field, or the fowls of the air either.  Adam was placed in the garden to tend and keep it. So it was to him that God gave the necessary instruction concerning the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, and the other trees of the garden.

Quote
@davetaff said:-
'For if you were cut from what is by nature a wild olive tree, and grafted, contrary to nature, into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, the natural branches, be grafted back into their own olive tree.
Romans 11:24 ESV
 
So Israel is seen as an olive tree only Israel had the law witch told them what good and evil is so Israel is the tree of knowledge so the man in genesis 2 is our lord at his first coming he is being told by the Father to not join in israels disobedience the woman who is to be created later is the Church.

Love and Peace
Dave

* Israel's covenant privileges are likened to 'an Olive Tree': but this is pure allegory.  Used in Judges 9:8, which is part of the words of Jotham beginning at verse 7. The parable is given in 8-15, and interpreted in v.16-20.  ('The Fig Tree' typifies Israel's national privileges; and 'the Bramble' is prophetic of the false nation under the rule of Antichrist, which will devour the nation as shown in v.20; the Vine represents Israel's spiritual blessings, which henceforth are to be found only in Christ, the True Vine (John 15))

* Israel's covenant privileges are once more likened to an Olive Tree in Romans 11.  These privileges are now in abeyance, as Israel is at present in a Loammi condition: 'not My People'. They will once more be 'My People' in a day to come. (Hosea 2:23)

* I do not consider the opinion you have expressed in this post to have any validity.  God does not need us to interpret His Words, for He does His own interpreting.  You can only do the word of God an injustice by continuing to do so.

Thank you.
In Christ Jesus
Chris


https://bible.com/bible/59/gen.2.16-17.ESV

Offline davetaff

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Re: Genesis
« Reply #91 on: August 07, 2020, 04:03:02 PM »
Hi
Moving on.

    Then the Lord God said, ?It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper fit for him.? Now out of the ground the Lord God had formed every beast of the field and every bird of the heavens and brought them to the man to see what he would call them. And whatever the man called every living creature, that was its name. The man gave names to all livestock and to the birds of the heavens and to every beast of the field. But for Adam there was not found a helper fit for him. So the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and while he slept took one of his ribs and closed up its place with flesh. And the rib that the Lord God had taken from the man he made into a woman and brought her to the man. Then the man said, ?This at last is bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.?
Genesis 2:18-‬23 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/gen.2.18-23.ESV           
 

So if I'm  right and Genesis 2 is concerning the last Adam what or who are all the animals mentioned here I believe they are the human race as a whole there was no one fit to be our Lords helper Israel had failed miserably so God sets about the creation of a woman to help him.
Now it gets interesting God puts the man into a deep sleep we now sleep can be equated with death so God puts the man asleep ( Christ crucified) the from his side he creates the woman from Christs side come the water and the blood from these the chuch is created the bride of Christ.
So we see that the creation of the woman in Genesis2 and the creation of the Church is basically  the same story.

Love and Peace
Dave


https://bible.com/bible/59/gen.2.18-23.ESV

Offline Cariad

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Re: Genesis
« Reply #92 on: August 07, 2020, 04:27:43 PM »
Hi
Moving on.

    Then the Lord God said, ?It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper fit for him.? Now out of the ground the Lord God had formed every beast of the field and every bird of the heavens and brought them to the man to see what he would call them. And whatever the man called every living creature, that was its name. The man gave names to all livestock and to the birds of the heavens and to every beast of the field. But for Adam there was not found a helper fit for him. So the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and while he slept took one of his ribs and closed up its place with flesh. And the rib that the Lord God had taken from the man he made into a woman and brought her to the man. Then the man said, ?This at last is bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.?
Genesis 2:18-‬23 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/gen.2.18-23.ESV           
 

So if I'm  right and Genesis 2 is concerning the last Adam what or who are all the animals mentioned here I believe they are the human race as a whole there was no one fit to be our Lords helper Israel had failed miserably so God sets about the creation of a woman to help him.
Now it gets interesting God puts the man into a deep sleep we now sleep can be equated with death so God puts the man asleep ( Christ crucified) the from his side he creates the woman from Christs side come the water and the blood from these the chuch is created the bride of Christ.
So we see that the creation of the woman in Genesis2 and the creation of the Church is basically  the same story.

Love and Peace
Dave
'And the LORD God said,
It is not good that the man should be alone;
I will make him an help meet for him
.
.. And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field,
.... and every fowl of the air;
...... and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them:
........ and whatsoever Adam called every living creature,
.......... that was the name thereof.
............ And Adam gave names to all cattle,
.............. and to the fowl of the air,
................ to every beast of the field;
but for Adam there was not found an help meet for him.
 
And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept:
.. and He took one of his ribs,
.... and closed up the flesh instead thereof;
And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man,
.. made He a woman,
.... and brought her unto the man.
And Adam said,
.. This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh:
.... she shall be called Woman,
...... because she was taken out of Man.
'

(Genesis 2:18-23) 

Hello Dave,

How sad it is that you cannot simply enjoy this record as it is, without spoiling it with your own understanding.

I will simply praise God, for giving us this record, and thank Him for His loving kindness, His mercy and His grace.

In Christ Jesus
Chris


https://bible.com/bible/59/gen.2.18-23.ESV

Offline davetaff

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Re: Genesis
« Reply #93 on: August 07, 2020, 06:19:31 PM »
Hi Chris
If I have said something wrong please point me to the scripture which  proves me wrong the things I say are based on  scripture why do I say we should se people as animals and trees because we find it in scripture.

    For it is written in the Law of Moses, ?You shall not muzzle an ox when it treads out the grain.? Is it for oxen that God is concerned? Does he not certainly speak for our sake? It was written for our sake, because the plowman should plow in hope and the thresher thresh in hope of sharing in the crop.
1 Corinthians 9:5, ‬7, ‬9-‬10 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/1co.9.5-10.ESV     


So we see that St Paul likens himself and those with him as oxen why .

Then we have

          .And he took the blind man by the hand and led him out of the village, and when he had spit on his eyes and laid his hands on him, he asked him, ?Do you see anything??  And he looked up and said, ?I see people, but they look like trees, walking.?
Mark 8:23-‬24 ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/mrk.8.23-24.ESV

     


Why did the man see men as trees did Christ make a mistake we both believe that that is not possible  so did Christ cure the man's spiritual blindness as well as physical.

Love and Peace
Dave
https://bible.com/bible/59/1co.9.5-10.ESV
https://bible.com/bible/59/mrk.8.23-24.ESV

Offline Cariad

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Re: Genesis
« Reply #94 on: August 07, 2020, 10:01:17 PM »
Hi
Moving on.

    Then the Lord God said, ?It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper fit for him.? Now out of the ground the Lord God had formed every beast of the field and every bird of the heavens and brought them to the man to see what he would call them. And whatever the man called every living creature, that was its name. The man gave names to all livestock and to the birds of the heavens and to every beast of the field. But for Adam there was not found a helper fit for him. So the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and while he slept took one of his ribs and closed up its place with flesh. And the rib that the Lord God had taken from the man he made into a woman and brought her to the man. Then the man said, ?This at last is bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.?
Genesis 2:18-‬23 ESV
 
So if I'm  right and Genesis 2 is concerning the last Adam what or who are all the animals mentioned here I believe they are the human race as a whole there was no one fit to be our Lords helper Israel had failed miserably so God sets about the creation of a woman to help him.
Now it gets interesting God puts the man into a deep sleep we now sleep can be equated with death so God puts the man asleep ( Christ crucified) the from his side he creates the woman from Christs side come the water and the blood from these the chuch is created the bride of Christ.
So we see that the creation of the woman in Genesis2 and the creation of the Church is basically  the same story.

Hello Dave,

The animals created in Genesis 2:19-20, are those of the sixth day of Genesis 1:24-31.  God saw it was not good for Adam to be alone.  He brought forward the beasts and fowl that he had created for Adam to name, but Adam was still very much alone.  So God made a woman, and Adam was no longer alone.  I do not read anything into what is written, it is sufficient in itself.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris
 

Offline Cariad

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Re: Genesis
« Reply #95 on: August 07, 2020, 10:02:58 PM »
Hi Chris
If I have said something wrong please point me to the scripture which  proves me wrong the things I say are based on  scripture why do I say we should see people as animals and trees because we find it in scripture.

    For it is written in the Law of Moses, ?You shall not muzzle an ox when it treads out the grain.? Is it for oxen that God is concerned? Does he not certainly speak for our sake? It was written for our sake, because the plowman should plow in hope and the thresher thresh in hope of sharing in the crop.
1 Corinthians 9:5, ‬7, ‬9-‬10 ESV

So we see that St Paul likens himself and those with him as oxen why?
Hello Dave,

'You shall not muzzle an ox when it treads out the grain':  This is a figure of speech, a proverb, with the same meaning as that in Matthew 9:12 'The workman is worthy of his hire'.  Paul was not likening himself, or his fellow workers to oxen.

Quote
davetaff said:-
Then we have:-
'And he took the blind man by the hand and led him out of the village, and when he had spit on his eyes and laid his hands on him, he asked him, 'Do you see anything?'  And he looked up and said, 'I see people, but they look like trees, walking.?'
Mark 8:23-‬24 ESV

Why did the man see men as trees did Christ make a mistake we both believe that is not possible  so did Christ cure the man's spiritual blindness as well as physical.

* The man's sight did not come back perfectly straight away, his sight was blurred, and though looking at men walking, he saw them as though trees walking.  He was healed physically of his blindness.

Within the love of Christ our Saviour,
our lord and Head.
Chris

 

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