Author Topic: Do angels have free will?  (Read 2188 times)

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Online strobe

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Re: Do angels have free will?
« Reply #72 on: May 27, 2020, 07:29:51 PM »

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'He that committeth sin is of the devil;
for the devil sinneth from the beginning.
For this purpose the Son of God was manifested,
that He might destroy the works of the devil.'

(1 John 3:8 ) 

Hello Stephen,

Thank you for explaining your user name: I was thinking of strobe, as in 'strobe lighting':)

Coming to your thoughts expressed in the quote above. In order to hold this belief you have to ignore much that is written in God's word: especially in regard to Satan's end, for it is well documented. In Ezekiel 28:16-19 God says,

1) I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God.
I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.


2) I will cast thee to the earth.
I will lay thee before kings


3) I will bring forth a fire from the midst of thee and it shall devour thee.
I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth.


4) Thou shalt be a terror
Never shalt thou be any more.


* Can anything be clearer than that?  The first movement deprives the anointed cherub of his glory and office.  The second casts him to the earth as a spectacle to kings.  The third sees him reduced to ashes by the fire brought from the midst of himself.  The fourth speaks of the effect of his destruction upon others.

* This punishment is future:- 'And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan,
which deceiveth the whole world : he was cast out unto the earth'
(Rev. 12:9 )

* 'I will bring forth a fire from the midst of thee' (Ezek 28:18 )

The fire that belonged to his exalted station, the continual accompaniment of Divine glory, that fire, when once the Divine protection is withdrawn, becomes the very instrument of his destruction, for we are not left in uncertainty regarding it's effect - 'It shall devour thee to ashes on the earth'. With this in mind Malachi 4:3 can be read:-

'And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet.'

* Do you not believe that God's word is true?

In Christ Jesus
Chris
You've not answered my main question though. If Satan was created perfect, how did he turn to sin and rebellion?
Also after everything is over, how can we be sure another angel won't turn to sin?
I've thought of another question. Did God know Satan was going to rebel before he did and if so why did He allow him to?
StRobe - As in Adam ... so in Christ

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Offline Winnie

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Re: Do angels have free will?
« Reply #73 on: May 27, 2020, 08:44:37 PM »
You've not answered my main question though. If Satan was created perfect, how did he turn to sin and rebellion?
Also after everything is over, how can we be sure another angel won't turn to sin?
I've thought of another question. Did God know Satan was going to rebel before he did and if so why did He allow him to?

'Thou wast perfect in thy ways
from the day that thou wast created,
till iniquity was found in thee.'

(Eze 28:15)   

Hello @strobe,

The answer to this question was in the reference from Ezekiel that I gave in my previous post. The anointed cherub, at his creation was perfect in beauty. The iniquity found in him being the result of his own pride, he became so. You are just as able to read these things as I am, so this is as far as I go, Strobe. You must answer your own questions.  The answers are there to be found.

With respect, I do not think you wish to believe what you read.

In Christ Jesus
Chris




Online strobe

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Re: Do angels have free will?
« Reply #74 on: May 27, 2020, 08:49:59 PM »
(1Ti 3:6)  Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
 
(1Ti 3:7)  Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
 
'Thou wast perfect in thy ways
from the day that thou wast created,
till iniquity was found in thee.'

(Eze 28:15)   

Hello @strobe,

The anointed cherub, at his creation was perfect in beauty. The iniquity found in him being the result of his own pride, he became so.
You are just as able to read these things as I am, so this is as far as I go, Strobe.

With respect, I do not think you wish to believe what you read.

In Christ Jesus
Chris
And with equal respect to you, Chris, I've given you verse after verse that prove universal reconciliation but I don't think you want to believe them either.

It doesn't matter though, differing opinions are acceptable.
StRobe - As in Adam ... so in Christ

Offline Serenity

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Re: Do angels have free will?
« Reply #75 on: June 03, 2020, 12:27:14 AM »
Thread reopened after a time of reflection on the subject.  Thanks for your posts, please continue.

Much love and peace in Christ 💖🔥
🔥💖GOD CAN USE ANYTHING, ANYWHERE, ANYTIME, ANYONE, ANYHOW, FOR HIS GOOD AND PURPOSE 💖🔥

Tes Johnson

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Re: Do angels have free will?
« Reply #76 on: June 05, 2020, 01:04:46 AM »
I know angels and Angels - have free will  .. in fact more than we do..

you ask "who gives permmision over our lives ...

well - Hi - @strobe


It sometimes  happens when people have a bad childhood / when the enemy can attack [due to your age - as at this time you are
vunerable]..

 angels...in fact they may have more free will than
we do...

Luke 22:31 - YOU - is plural - meaning that all would be sifted - letting into  lives a Spiritual //
sifting/ attack/temptation - cos we all have weakness


Online strobe

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Re: Do angels have free will?
« Reply #77 on: June 07, 2020, 02:00:11 PM »
Hi @Tes Johnson
Thanks for your input.
Luke 22:31 Simon, Simon, behold, Satan demanded to have you, that he might sift you like wheat
Sorry, I am missing how this shows that he has free will. I am suggesting that God requires us to be sifted like wheat and that it is impossible for us to have free will and be released from our shackles until we have been sifted.
Peace and love
StRobe - As in Adam ... so in Christ

Offline Christianna

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Re: Do angels have free will?
« Reply #78 on: June 07, 2020, 08:37:46 PM »
I know angels and Angels - have free will  .. in fact more than we do..

you ask "who gives permmision over our lives ...

well - Hi - @strobe


It sometimes  happens when people have a bad childhood / when the enemy can attack [due to your age - as at this time you are
vunerable]..

 angels...in fact they may have more free will than
we do...

Luke 22:31 - YOU - is plural - meaning that all would be sifted - letting into  lives a Spiritual //
sifting/ attack/temptation - cos we all have weakness



I can relate to what you are saying and it's not a figure of speech, but literal experiences. Fallen angels can attack people who have damage in their background, sadly. That they use different tactics, when you get familiar with previous tactics.

God however, can lead us to be victorious over them and show us how to wear the armour of God. Therefore we can claim the promise to tread down the snakes and scorpions, in Christ, in prayer.

Luke 10:19 Jesus said : "I have given you authority to trample on snakes and scorpions and to overcome all the power of the enemy; nothing will harm you."

They are nothing but devious creatures in a cage, wanting us to be afraid and let them out Of the cage. They can be like the giant terrors of the night but in the Sanctuary of God's protection they are like scarey toy puppets, trying to scare you but of no effect. They are afraid of the authority of Christ. They will leave your presence, when  God leads you in prayer and gives you Words to say. You can also play YouTube with other peoples' prayers, in the authority of Christ.

Back to the question they appear to have more freewill than us, because they attack, as well as tempt us and  trick us, in every way they can. I don't know one scripture in the bible, that shows mercy on fallen angels. They must be in full control of what they do, with no turning back, unlike human beings.


For God is benevolent in nature and bearing that in mind, must surely back up that angels have total freewill.





Tes Johnson

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Re: Do angels have free will?
« Reply #79 on: June 08, 2020, 12:12:15 AM »
I can relate to what you are saying and it's not a figure of speech, but literal experiences. Fallen angels can attack people who have damage in their background, sadly. That they use different tactics, when you get familiar with previous tactics.

God however, can lead us to be victorious over them and show us how to wear the armour of God. Therefore we can claim the promise to tread down the snakes and scorpions, in Christ, in prayer.

Luke 10:19 Jesus said : "I have given you authority to trample on snakes and scorpions and to overcome all the power of the enemy; nothing will harm you."

They are nothing but devious creatures in a cage, wanting us to be afraid and let them out Of the cage. They can be like the giant terrors of the night but in the Sanctuary of God's protection they are like scarey toy puppets, trying to scare you but of no effect. They are afraid of the authority of Christ. They will leave your presence, when  God leads you in prayer and gives you Words to say. You can also play YouTube with other peoples' prayers, in the authority of Christ.

Back to the question they appear to have more freewill than us, because they attack, as well as tempt us and  trick us, in every way they can. I don't know one scripture in the bible, that shows mercy on fallen angels. They must be in full control of what they do, with no turning back, unlike human beings.


For God is benevolent in nature and bearing that in mind, must surely back up that angels have total freewill.




Yes @Christianna -  the argument I was trying to put across ATT - was that as demons can suppress - oppress and possess  - lives over many years - how does the person have free will during these years ? and how can a demon/fallen angel enemy/ repent ..

In a sense angels have free will [over humans] in another sense - they do not have free will to change "who they are"

In a sense when it comes to repentance they are already judged - whereas the person under their control - does,nt seem to have the ability /free will/ to release themselves.. other than prayer / deliverance..

While I was typing this post I was thinking about "Jesus going to the Cross and how the powers and  principalities came up against Him rising up through the people around Him and I was thinking about the scripture - "Father forgive then because they don't know what they are doing"

I wonder if Jesus was speaking about [the people not knowing what they had done] or [the dark side /enemy/demons/fallen angels] not knowing what they had done [either way neither knew]

In a sense no one had free will when it came to the death of Jesus [as it was prophesied / before time]


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