Author Topic: Re: The Sword of Amos  (Read 243 times)

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Offline davetaff

Re: The Sword of Amos
« Reply #8 on: September 29, 2018, 04:09:16 PM »
I have split this topic as there are many good questions

I would be good to question various things - re:

1. What is God's Love.

2. Could/Does God commit genocide - was/is/God/against certain peoples [such as the Pharisees / Philistines/.

So what is Gods Love how dose he show his Love for humanity as a whole our Lord had this to say

Joh 15:13  Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.
       


And this is very true but was the fathers love for humanity greater

Rom 5:8  But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
     


God sent his son to die for his enemies that is us sinners and Christ died in obedience to the fathers will surely there can be no greater love than these two great sacrifices.

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2. Could/Does God commit genocide - was/is/God/against certain peoples [such as the Pharisees / Philistines/.
     

Not an easy question I suppose the first great genocide in scripture is Noah's flood the whole human race was wiped out except for eight people how can we account for the God of Love doing such a terrible thing.
May be there is more to the flood story than meets the eye for example is there a great flood covering the earth the water of the word of God which is killing millions in baptism yes it is a form of genocide but with a much better outcome.
Just an old mans ramblings but I have always had problems with the flood story its out of character for a God who says he loves us.

Love and Peace
Dave   

Offline Deborah

Re: Re: The Sword of Amos
« Reply #9 on: September 29, 2018, 04:11:51 PM »
Hi Deborah
Thank you for your post

I am well aware of this what I am saying or asking if you like is was God responsible for responsible for the genocide that took place or was he only giving warnings of what was going to happen.

It was a violent age, with all the local kingdoms continually fighting against each other. The 'punishments' suffered by these nations were 'normal' for warfare during that time. God didn't have to encourage Babylon to invade Philistia and Ammon; they would have done it anyway. It's a two-layered way of looking at history: human beings do what they want, and sometimes God uses what they freely decide to do as part of His own purposes.


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I can agree with that but what we believe must be consistent don't you think if God Is the God of Love then can he also be the God of genocide at the same time don't you think the God who created the universe and everything in it would have a better answer.
But what if "God is the God of love" is an inadequate description of God? He isn't only a God of love; He's also a God of justice. And if you go back to Genesis, He pronounced a death sentence on Adam! What was "loving" about that - unless perhaps the alternative (not punishing rebellion and evil) was worse?

"My grace is sufficient for you, for My power is made perfect in weakness." (II Corinthians 12:9)

Offline Deborah

Re: The Sword of Amos
« Reply #10 on: September 29, 2018, 04:15:32 PM »
I have split this topic as there are many good questions

I would be good to question various things - re:

1. What is God's Love.

2. Could/Does God commit genocide - was/is/God/against certain peoples [such as the Pharisees / Philistines/.

1) Whatever God's love is, it doesn't mean that He's invariably "nice" to everyone, all the time.

2) We all die because Adam originally sinned (and we all sin as well). So whenever or however we die, it's God's judgement upon us. God treats everyone the same; He has no favourites. The point of Amos' message (as we'll see) is that He won't treat His own people (Israel) any differently: they too will be punished for their sins. So no, He isn't "against" any particular people - unless they are particularly "against" Him.
"My grace is sufficient for you, for My power is made perfect in weakness." (II Corinthians 12:9)

Offline Guardian

Re: The Sword of Amos
« Reply #11 on: September 30, 2018, 12:10:53 AM »
  2) We all die because Adam originally sinned (and we all sin as well). So whenever or however we die, it's God's judgement upon us. God treats everyone the same; He has no favourites.



  2) But what if "God is the God of love" is an inadequate description of God? He isn't only a God of love; He's also a God of justice. And if you go back to Genesis, He pronounced a death sentence on Adam! What was "loving" about that - unless perhaps the alternative (not punishing rebellion and evil) was worse?.


I think that jas answered it - in a nutshell    :police:


Cannot really add  to it ...





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Offline davetaff

Re: The Sword of Amos
« Reply #12 on: September 30, 2018, 04:21:30 PM »
Hi
Deborah said.
Quote
But what if "God is the God of love" is an inadequate description of God? He isn't only a God of love; He's also a God of justice. And if you go back to Genesis, He pronounced a death sentence on Adam! What was "loving" about that - unless perhaps the alternative (not punishing rebellion and evil) was worse?
   
This is true the question being when will God meet out his justice is it on a day to day basis or will it be when.

Jer 23:5  Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth.
Jer 23:6  In his days Judah shall be saved, and Israel shall dwell safely: and this is his name whereby he shall be called, THE LORD OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS.
   


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We all die because Adam originally sinned (and we all sin as well). So whenever or however we die, it's God's judgement upon us     

Do we die all through the NT death is likend to sleep so if we are sleeping after this life is over are we realy dead of course there are those who will always reject God for them is

Rev 21:8  But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
   


Love and Peace
Dave


I take this to mean a our Lords second coming when he sits as king of the whole earth the question being will they have an oppertunity to repent or will we all be judged on what we have done in this life.
the other question is what will all those who have been baptised with fire be doing at this time meating out justice or preaching Gods word.
 

Offline davetaff

Re: The Sword of Amos
« Reply #13 on: October 05, 2018, 01:47:39 PM »
I have split this topic as there are many good questions

I would be good to question various things - re:

1. What is God's Love.

2. Could/Does God commit genocide - was/is/God/against certain peoples [such as the Pharisees / Philistines/.

Hi
God is love what does it mean God is also the greatest force in the universe can we say everything God has done in creation is done in Love.
We are also told that to be like God we need a knowledge of good and evil is this why the world looks the way it dose.
So the only way we can rectify the world is through Love love God and love each other.
What is love it is a freewill gift from the heart no one can make you love someone else it is something we must do our selves from the heart.
What we love is also important as Paul tells us.

     1Ti 6:10 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows   

Yes the Love of money has taken over the world and it is a great evil and it's so easy to become trapped by it.
Has God provided enough for everyone if everything is shared out properly.

Love and Peace
Dave


Offline davetaff

Re: The Sword of Amos
« Reply #14 on: October 16, 2018, 11:46:18 AM »
Hi
The sword of Amos what is it is it the same sword as the rider on the white horse in revelations which is the sword of truth the word of God.
Or is it a sword of retribution with which God would deal with his disobedient child Israel dose God wield the sword him self or does he let the nation's around Israel do it for him.
Does God take responsibility for there actions because he could prevent them if he chose to do so but he does not because of the covenant he made with Israel to continue to have his blessings they must be obedient to his laws.
Israel suffers because they broke the covenant but God will always keep his side because the scriptures says all Israel will be saved.

Love and Peace
Dave