Author Topic: Creation or Evolution  (Read 4137 times)

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Offline John

Re: Creation or Evolution
« Reply #32 on: July 26, 2018, 08:17:31 PM »
Except when God did localised destructive events like Sodom, he told those who were listening to leave.
He gave Noah at least a hundred years warning, ample time for him to have walked to mountains outside of the flood area.
Why tell him to build such a big ark for a localised flood, which surely didn't lasr as long as the bible says.

When one looks at how much of the earths surface is waterbourne sedimentary rocks. The vast areas covered by one type of rock, there are no processes currently at work that is laying don rocks that we find around the world.
These, the bent, yet not cracked or distorted layered rocks, the fact that many fosils had to be burried rapidly as in jellyfich, or fish giving birth, together with the large fosil deposits that the excervaters say were laid down by fast moving water, planation, water gaps etc etc etc all point to a global flood.

Offline Deborah

Re: Creation or Evolution
« Reply #33 on: July 26, 2018, 09:04:42 PM »
Except when God did localised destructive events like Sodom, he told those who were listening to leave.
He gave Noah at least a hundred years warning, ample time for him to have walked to mountains outside of the flood area.
Why tell him to build such a big ark for a localised flood, which surely didn't lasr as long as the bible says.

When one looks at how much of the earths surface is waterbourne sedimentary rocks. The vast areas covered by one type of rock, there are no processes currently at work that is laying don rocks that we find around the world.
These, the bent, yet not cracked or distorted layered rocks, the fact that many fosils had to be burried rapidly as in jellyfich, or fish giving birth, together with the large fosil deposits that the excervaters say were laid down by fast moving water, planation, water gaps etc etc etc all point to a global flood.

Where does it say that Noah had a hundred years warning? The flood came when his sons were 100 years old (Genesis 5:32; 7:6)- but they were already married when God gave him his instructions (Genesis 6:11-21)!
"His divine power has given us everything we need for a godly life." (II Peter 1:3a)

Offline davetaff

Re: Creation or Evolution
« Reply #34 on: July 27, 2018, 10:39:35 AM »
Hi Tara
You keep saying that evolution is a fact can you give any evidence to support this statement.
When I go out on the net to check out these things for every site on evolution there is a site on creation that refutes it so it all boils down to belief.
For my self it is far more logical to believe that all life forms on this planet were created so logic tells me there has to be a God.
You are telling me that all life forms on this planet created them selves from dead matter you will need to prove that the missing link is still missing.
You say that Maybe God caused the big bang and it there was a big bang I am sure God was the cause because when the big bang happens two forces came into play explosion and implosion or gravity the difference between these two forces are so small it would be mathematically impossible.
If the force of explosion was any greater on solid objects could form if gravity was any greater everything would be drawn back into one solid lump.
So if there was a big bang then it must have been controlled God's first act of creation ??

Love and Peace
Dave

Offline John

Re: Creation or Evolution
« Reply #35 on: July 27, 2018, 02:43:03 PM »
Deborah,
         As Gen 5 says Noah was 500 years old when he had three sons. as gen7 says he was 600 when the flood came. We don't know when between those dates Noah was told to build the Ark.
Assuming time for the boys to grow that leaves approx 70 years to build a 400 foot long boat, and to assemble/store enough food to last for a year for the animals.

Noah is called a preacher of rightousness 2Peter2:4-6. Did he literaly preach or was it his building of an Ark that revealed his preaching.

The bible says he built it and that the flood lasted for over a year.
Either the bible is correct or it is not.
The problem is if there never was a fall, if death has always been part of creation, if the image of baptism and salvation through an Ark are lies/myths
Then the plauges of Eygpt are too, as are Jericho, Elisha and the prophets of baal, and what of the Christmas story?
What of the easter story how are they different from Noah and the Ark or joanh and the whale(fish)?

TaraH

  • Guest
Re: Creation or Evolution
« Reply #36 on: July 27, 2018, 03:27:35 PM »
Hi @davetaff ,

I?m glad you?re having a look and trying to understand evolution.  Can i suggest that you look at what the theory of evolution is.  Get a handle on the basic principles, then you can look at the arguments against it.  Don?t look at the arguments first, understand it first. 

Tara


Offline Deborah

Re: Creation or Evolution
« Reply #37 on: July 27, 2018, 05:32:14 PM »
Deborah,
         As Gen 5 says Noah was 500 years old when he had three sons. as gen7 says he was 600 when the flood came. We don't know when between those dates Noah was told to build the Ark.

"We don't know" - exactly, so you can't assume that it was even one year before the Flood! So you can't argue that he "would have had time to walk out of the flood area".

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Noah is called a preacher of rightousness 2Peter2:4-6. Did he literaly preach or was it his building of an Ark that revealed his preaching.
Interesting question, but a red herring. What difference does it make?

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The bible says he built it and that the flood lasted for over a year.
Either the bible is correct or it is not.
A localised 'flood' might last a long time. Some have speculated that the Flood was the filling of the Black Sea. The Bible doesn't state that the water went back all the way to its original level...

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The problem is if there never was a fall, if death has always been part of creation, if the image of baptism and salvation through an Ark are lies/myths
Evolution (the theistic variety) doesn't rule out either the Fall or the Ark.
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Then the plauges of Eygpt are too, as are Jericho, Elisha and the prophets of baal, and what of the Christmas story?
What of the easter story how are they different from Noah and the Ark or joanh and the whale(fish)?
There are differences in style between the stories in the early chapters of Genesis and the 'family history' from Abraham onwards. Personally, I would say that the stories in Genesis 1-11 are based on actual events but are told in a modified 'mythological' form that universalises them. (May I remind you that the word 'myth', in its technical sense, does NOT mean 'untrue'!) We can roughly date Abraham (to around 2000 BC) from the historical, geographical and cultural information in Genesis; we can't do that for Noah, let alone Adam. When it comes to the historical books and the Gospels, well, they are 'history' in the more familiar sense and are to be interpreted as such, whatever we think about Genesis.
"His divine power has given us everything we need for a godly life." (II Peter 1:3a)

Offline davetaff

Re: Creation or Evolution
« Reply #38 on: July 27, 2018, 06:13:35 PM »
Hi @davetaff ,

I?m glad you?re having a look and trying to understand evolution.  Can i suggest that you look at what the theory of evolution is.  Get a handle on the basic principles, then you can look at the arguments against it.  Don?t look at the arguments first, understand it first. 

Tara

Hi Tara
Thank you for your reply but why you think I am interested in the fairy story called evolution is beyond me.
I was hoping you would answer the question what evidence do you have that evolution is a fact.

Love and Peace
Dave


Offline John

Re: Creation or Evolution
« Reply #39 on: July 27, 2018, 06:55:47 PM »
Hi Deborah,
               "We don't know" - exactly, so you can't assume that it was even one year before the Flood! So you can't argue that he "would have had time to walk out of the flood area".


He had time enough to build a 400 foot lond Ark, he would have had time enough to walk out of the area affected by the flood.

"A localised 'flood' might last a long time. Some have speculated that the Flood was the filling of the Black Sea. The Bible doesn't state that the water went back all the way to its original level..."

Or it was a global flood as the bible discribes.

"Evolution (the theistic variety) doesn't rule out either the Fall or the Ark."

But it does belief that death predates the fall and doesn't believe that the Ark is real.

Yes Genesis tell a story, a story of Creation and of mans rebellion and the start of Gods redemption of man.

It is a story that makes no sence if it isn't true.