Author Topic: War and Peace  (Read 2236 times)

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Offline francis drake

Re: War and Peace
« Reply #64 on: April 05, 2018, 10:00:22 PM »

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You play with the words murder and killing to justify killing others the law said thou shalt not kill but we are not under the law but under grace and we are commanded to Love.

Dave, you are truly hilarious, telling us that we are not under Law, but Grace. Do you not realise that the scriptures you keep quoting in Matt5 are all Law, not Grace.

You cannot have it both ways Dave, either obey every last jot and title of Matt5, including chopping your hands off and poking your eyes out when you get it wrong, or walk away from Matt5 and enter God's free grace.

So Dave, here's what Matt5 entails for you.-
You cannot ever lock the door of your house or your car, because verse39 says "do not resist an evil person".
You must also cancel any insurance policies because again in verse 39 you are commanded "to turn the other cheek also".
If your wife or daughter is being raped, you cannot call the police because that's retaliation by proxy not turning the other cheek.

You are also commanded to give double to anyone who asks at any time no excuses and do anything double that anyone asks of you at all times.

Disturb us Lord, when we are too pleased with ourselves. When our dreams have come true because we dreamed too little. When we arrived safely because we sailed too close to the shore. Disturb us Lord, to dare more boldly. To venture on wider seas. Where storms will show your mastery; Where, losing sight of land, we shall find the stars. We ask you to push back the horizons of our hopes; And to push into the future, in strength, courage, hope and love.                     (SIR FRANCIS DRAKE 1577)

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Offline davetaff

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Re: War and Peace
« Reply #65 on: April 06, 2018, 04:15:30 PM »
Hi Frances
Thanks for your reply as for the law it tells us what sin is if we break the least of one of its statutes we break the whole law which makes us sinners and in need of salvation.
our Lord said that nothing would pass from the law till all things were fulfilled but what did change was our lord gave us a better way of complying with the law through LOVE if we love as he commanded us then we comply with the law of God and the Laws of Man we don't even have to know what they are.

we seam to be getting of track a bit the point of the thread was if the commands of the governing body in the country we live in are against the commands of our Lord who do we follow Jesus or Mr May.

As for your speeding ticket not only did you break the law of the land and paid the price you also broke the laws of love by driving to fast you may have endangered the lives of others so you were not acting in love for your fellow man ( neighbour ).

As for God intervening in the affairs of men of course he dose God has a plan and nothing we do will hinder it men may start wars but God decides the out come but it dose not mean he condones wars and the indiscriminate killing of civilians or killing of any kind you cannot Love some one and then kill them.t

As for Matt 5 It is one of the most beautiful passages in scripture it is all about Love and is for everyone Jew and Gentile alike    GOD IS LOVE

Love and Peace
Dave   
 

Offline francis drake

Re: War and Peace
« Reply #66 on: April 07, 2018, 03:03:27 PM »
Hi Frances
Thanks for your reply as for the law it tells us what sin is if we break the least of one of its statutes we break the whole law which makes us sinners and in need of salvation.
our Lord said that nothing would pass from the law till all things were fulfilled but what did change was our lord gave us a better way of complying with the law through LOVE if we love as he commanded us then we comply with the law of God and the Laws of Man we don't even have to know what they are.
No Dave, nothing changed whatsoever, and its foolishness to imagine that Jesus gave "love" as a replacement to the Law.
Even when he spoke about love, Jesus always returned to was written already in the Law.
ie. Matt23v35And one of them, a lawyer, questioned Him, testing Him, 36?Teacher, which commandment is the greatest in the Law?? v37And He said to him, ??You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.?d 38This is the great and first commandment. 39And the second is like it: ?You shall love your neighbor as yourself.
40 On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."

As you can see, love was already the very foundation of the original Law of Moses, and not a new idea of Jesus.
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As for your speeding ticket not only did you break the law of the land and paid the price you also broke the laws of love by driving to fast you may have endangered the lives of others so you were not acting in love for your fellow man ( neighbour ).
Nonsense. It might be true if I was driving foolishly amongst other traffic, but the roads were bare.
Quote
As for Matt 5 It is one of the most beautiful passages in scripture it is all about Love and is for everyone Jew and Gentile alike    GOD IS LOVE
Do you understand what "Woe" means Dave? It means affliction, trouble, tribulation! Here's how Jesus loves the Pharisees.-

Matt23v13But woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you shut up the kingdom of the heavens before men. For you neither enter, nor even do you allow those who are entering to go in.
V15. Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!....................
V16. Woe to you blind guides..........................
V23. Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites..................
V25. Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites..........
V27. Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites..................
V29. Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites......................33Serpents! Offspring of vipers! How shall you escape from the damnation of Hell?

That's love for you Dave. God is love, but He is also justice.
Jesus is the same yesterday today and forever! ie. He is exactly the same in the Old Testament, the New Testament, throughout the ages and eternity.
Disturb us Lord, when we are too pleased with ourselves. When our dreams have come true because we dreamed too little. When we arrived safely because we sailed too close to the shore. Disturb us Lord, to dare more boldly. To venture on wider seas. Where storms will show your mastery; Where, losing sight of land, we shall find the stars. We ask you to push back the horizons of our hopes; And to push into the future, in strength, courage, hope and love.                     (SIR FRANCIS DRAKE 1577)

Offline davetaff

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Re: War and Peace
« Reply #67 on: April 07, 2018, 06:47:37 PM »
Hi Frances
Thank you for your reply I am not sure what you are reading but I have never said love replaced the law what I did say was if we Love as our lord commanded then we keep the law.
The law remains we all break the law we sin and pay the penalty we all die this Gods sentence on the human race but God has given us a way out the resurrection of the dead.

God is Love therefore love is the most powerful force in the universe and through that love all things will be completed according to his will.

Love and Peace
Dave

Offline francis drake

Re: War and Peace
« Reply #68 on: April 07, 2018, 11:18:38 PM »
Hi Frances
Thank you for your reply I am not sure what you are reading but I have never said love replaced the law what I did say was if we Love as our lord commanded then we keep the law.
The law remains we all break the law we sin and pay the penalty we all die this Gods sentence on the human race but God has given us a way out the resurrection of the dead.

God is Love therefore love is the most powerful force in the universe and through that love all things will be completed according to his will.
Christ is love, but he is also Justice. ie. Not everybody gets his love.

You ignored it last time so I'll post it again.-
Do you understand what "Woe" means Dave? It means affliction, trouble, tribulation! Here's how Jesus loves the Pharisees.-

Matt23v13But woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you shut up the kingdom of the heavens before men. For you neither enter, nor even do you allow those who are entering to go in.
V15. Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!....................
V16. Woe to you blind guides..........................
V23. Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites..................
V25. Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites..........
V27. Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites..................
V29. Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites......................33Serpents! Offspring of vipers! How shall you escape from the damnation of Hell?

That's love for you Dave. God is love, but He is also justice.
Jesus is the same yesterday today and forever! ie. He is exactly the same in the Old Testament, the New Testament, throughout the ages and eternity.
Disturb us Lord, when we are too pleased with ourselves. When our dreams have come true because we dreamed too little. When we arrived safely because we sailed too close to the shore. Disturb us Lord, to dare more boldly. To venture on wider seas. Where storms will show your mastery; Where, losing sight of land, we shall find the stars. We ask you to push back the horizons of our hopes; And to push into the future, in strength, courage, hope and love.                     (SIR FRANCIS DRAKE 1577)

Offline Tes Johnson

Re: War and Peace
« Reply #69 on: April 08, 2018, 02:12:47 AM »


How is the Law summoned up ?

Matthew 22:37Jesus replied: ? ?Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.?c 38This is the first and greatest commandment. 39And the second is like it: ?Love your neighbor as
yourself.?d 40All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.?



Not sure that any of us fulfill this >?


Offline davetaff

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Re: War and Peace
« Reply #70 on: April 08, 2018, 04:06:20 PM »
Christ is love, but he is also Justice. ie. Not everybody gets his love.

You ignored it last time so I'll post it again.-
Do you understand what "Woe" means Dave? It means affliction, trouble, tribulation! Here's how Jesus loves the Pharisees.-

Matt23v13But woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you shut up the kingdom of the heavens before men. For you neither enter, nor even do you allow those who are entering to go in.
V15. Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!....................
V16. Woe to you blind guides..........................
V23. Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites..................
V25. Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites..........
V27. Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites..................
V29. Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites......................33Serpents! Offspring of vipers! How shall you escape from the damnation of Hell?

That's love for you Dave. God is love, but He is also justice.
Jesus is the same yesterday today and forever! ie. He is exactly the same in the Old Testament, the New Testament, throughout the ages and eternity.

Hi Frances
Thank you for your post you said not every one gets his love I think that is about as wrong as you can get it

1Jn 2:2  And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
1Jn 2:3  And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
   


He died for the whole world for every sinner scribes and Pharisees included what was wrong with the scribes and Pharisees they were teaching the letter of the law and not the spirit of the law.
 The spirit of the law is love if you keep the law you show love to your fellow man the law was given to Israel man in Gods image when Christ came the second Adam he kept the law perfectly and showed us what love is he loved mankind so much that he died for every one of us the good the bad and the ugly.

All the woes Jesus directed at the scribes and Pharisees was because he loved them and wanted then to have a change of heart and follow him.

Isa 42:1  Behold my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles.
Isa 42:2  He shall not cry, nor lift up, nor cause his voice to be heard in the street.
Isa 42:3  A bruised reed shall he not break, and the smoking flax shall he not quench: he shall bring forth judgment unto truth.
Isa 42:4  He shall not fail nor be discouraged, till he have set judgment in the earth: and the isles shall wait for his law.
   


Our Lord did not come armies and weapons of mass destruction read the above quite and meek and what was his law the law of Love.
The law given to Moses was also a law of love but it was also accompanied with a curse for disobedience but Christ became a Curse for us.

Gal 3:13  Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
   
   

The curse of the law is death the free gift of love by our Lord Jesus Christ is eternal life.

Love and Peace
Dave 

Offline francis drake

Re: War and Peace
« Reply #71 on: April 10, 2018, 09:45:20 PM »
Hi Frances
Thank you for your post you said not every one gets his love I think that is about as wrong as you can get it
Matt8v12But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Is casting people into eternal damnation the same as loving them Dave?
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1Jn 2:2  And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
Of course Jesus paid for the sins of the whole world, but the benefits were not received by the whole world were they?
Quote
He died for the whole world for every sinner scribes and Pharisees included what was wrong with the scribes and Pharisees they were teaching the letter of the law and not the spirit of the law.
Yet he told the Pharisees they were on the way to eternal damnation.
Quote
The spirit of the law is love if you keep the law you show love to your fellow man the law was given to Israel man in Gods image
If you start bringing your "Israel, man in God's image" drivel into this thread, I'm out of here Dave. Stick to the narrative.
Quote
The spirit of the law is love if you keep the law you show love to your fellow man the law was given to Israel man in Gods image when Christ came the second Adam he kept the law perfectly and showed us what love is he loved mankind so much that he died for every one of us the good the bad and the ugly.
Certainly, nobody doubts that Jesus paid for all mankind with his blood, but unregenerate mankind still remains outside of God's love and well on their way to eternal damnation.
Quote
All the woes Jesus directed at the scribes and Pharisees was because he loved them and wanted then to have a change of heart and follow him.
Jesus already knew they would reject him so his words were actually prophetic, just as his judgement on Jerusalem was prophetic.
Quote
Isa 42:1  Behold my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles.
Isa 42:2  He shall not cry, nor lift up, nor cause his voice to be heard in the street.
Isa 42:3  A bruised reed shall he not break, and the smoking flax shall he not quench: he shall bring forth judgment unto truth.
Isa 42:4  He shall not fail nor be discouraged, till he have set judgment in the earth: and the isles shall wait for his law.
   


Our Lord did not come armies and weapons of mass destruction read the above quite and meek and what was his law the law of Love.
The law given to Moses was also a law of love but it was also accompanied with a curse for disobedience but Christ became a Curse for us.
Wrong. The Law remains as does its curse. The disobedient who reject God will still spend eternity without God.
Quote
Gal 3:13  Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
   
   
Jesus took the penalty, but those who reject God's love and salvation will pay their own penalty for eternity.
Quote
The curse of the law is death the free gift of love by our Lord Jesus Christ is eternal life.
The free gift of love is not for the proud. It only comes to the humble,.
Disturb us Lord, when we are too pleased with ourselves. When our dreams have come true because we dreamed too little. When we arrived safely because we sailed too close to the shore. Disturb us Lord, to dare more boldly. To venture on wider seas. Where storms will show your mastery; Where, losing sight of land, we shall find the stars. We ask you to push back the horizons of our hopes; And to push into the future, in strength, courage, hope and love.                     (SIR FRANCIS DRAKE 1577)

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