Author Topic: Forgiveness, unconditionally  (Read 2846 times)

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Offline davetaff

Re: Forgiveness, unconditionally
« Reply #48 on: June 19, 2018, 09:30:00 AM »
Dave,
             You are agreeing with me, by saying that the offending party has to say sorry, which is the biblical poisition.

Hi John
I think you are misreading what I said I never said that we should wait for the other party to say sorry but follow the example of our Lord and saviour who while we were still sinners died for us and in so doing made forgiveness possible.

Love and Peace
Dave

Online John

Re: Forgiveness, unconditionally
« Reply #49 on: June 19, 2018, 01:18:26 PM »
Dave,
 you are mistaking the offer for the act of recieving.
Yes Jesus offers forgiveness, but if it is not accepted there is no forgiveness.
To accept Jesus's forgiveness one has to repent and humbly recieve the forgiveness.

Offline davetaff

Re: Forgiveness, unconditionally
« Reply #50 on: June 20, 2018, 05:39:47 PM »
Dave,
 you are mistaking the offer for the act of recieving.
Yes Jesus offers forgiveness, but if it is not accepted there is no forgiveness.
To accept Jesus's forgiveness one has to repent and humbly recieve the forgiveness.

Hi John
Thanks for the reply the point I am trying to make is we as Christians should be the first to offer the hand of freindship to say let bygones by bygones I am sorry if I have offended the other party then its up to them if they don't wish to make peace that's up to them we have fulfilled our obligation as followers of Christ.


Love and Peace
Dave

Online John

Re: Forgiveness, unconditionally
« Reply #51 on: June 21, 2018, 02:57:43 PM »
Dave,
          I'm not interested in two people exchanging words. I'm talking about when a Christian is brutally murdered, defrauded, falsly imprisoned and other savage assaults on a person.

it has happened and they or there relatives have been under the impression that they as Christians, must offer forgiveness to who ever attacked/murdered etc.


Take the real life example of Corry ten Boon, she had no requirement to offer forgiveness to the murderer of her Father or of her sister, untill those involved asked her for forgiveness. Which she admits was impossible for her without God's grace.


As for your example of people falling out, if they are both Christian then they have no choice they must forgive if the offender says sorry.

Who should make the fiorst move, that will depend on how deeply offended one is and is up to them.

Offline Sharky and George

Re: Forgiveness, unconditionally
« Reply #52 on: June 21, 2018, 03:40:09 PM »
Forgiveness is so important and we should always forgive as Jesus said we should do it 77 times 7 times (keep on forgiving). My opinion is that we should then even if they have not said sorry or ask for forgiveness:
As the Romans banged the nails through His hands on the cross He prayed Father forgive them for they do not know what they do. Do you think the Roman soldiers said sorry?


Father God I forgive the people who have sinned against me as they are hurting and do not understand what they do.
Please forgive me Father, I confess my sins before you and I repent of them. Please help me to change my ways, I love you Father and I know that I am the world to you.

Offline francis drake

Re: Forgiveness, unconditionally
« Reply #53 on: June 21, 2018, 11:06:04 PM »
Forgiveness is so important and we should always forgive as Jesus said we should do it 77 times 7 times (keep on forgiving). My opinion is that we should then even if they have not said sorry or ask for forgiveness:
Forgiveness is directly related to repentance, you cannot have one without the other and to teach otherwise is a false gospel!
Luke17v3Take heed to yourselves: If your brother should sin, rebuke him; and if he should repent, forgive him. 4And if he should sin against you seven times in the day, and seven times should return to you, saying ?I repent,? you shall forgive him.?
As Jesus shows above, forgiveness is given only when the offender repents.
And by the way, saying sorry is not what repentance means.

You have fallen into the trap of the social gospel, making God treat those who love him and those who hate him as equals.
It is pride that makes people reject God, and scripture states that God resists the proud, but gives grace to the humble, and only to the humble.

You are effectively stating that God gives grace to the proud!
Disturb us Lord, when we are too pleased with ourselves. When our dreams have come true because we dreamed too little. When we arrived safely because we sailed too close to the shore. Disturb us Lord, to dare more boldly. To venture on wider seas. Where storms will show your mastery; Where, losing sight of land, we shall find the stars. We ask you to push back the horizons of our hopes; And to push into the future, in strength, courage, hope and love.                     (SIR FRANCIS DRAKE 1577)

Offline Sharky and George

Re: Forgiveness, unconditionally
« Reply #54 on: June 22, 2018, 06:03:07 PM »
"Straw man".

Bless you.

Offline francis drake

Re: Forgiveness, unconditionally
« Reply #55 on: June 22, 2018, 10:08:35 PM »
"Straw man".

Bless you.
If you are accusing me of making a "straw man" argument, then you don't understand what that definition means.

I responded to a statement you made, showing that it contradicted scripture.

Maybe you could show me why it's a straw man.
Disturb us Lord, when we are too pleased with ourselves. When our dreams have come true because we dreamed too little. When we arrived safely because we sailed too close to the shore. Disturb us Lord, to dare more boldly. To venture on wider seas. Where storms will show your mastery; Where, losing sight of land, we shall find the stars. We ask you to push back the horizons of our hopes; And to push into the future, in strength, courage, hope and love.                     (SIR FRANCIS DRAKE 1577)