Author Topic: Forgiveness, unconditionally  (Read 6463 times)

Description:

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline davetaff

Re: Forgiveness, unconditionally
« Reply #120 on: December 24, 2018, 03:45:29 PM »
Hi TJ
thank you for your post plenty to think about you said


Well what do you make of John 14:28 ?  "The Father is greater than I"   ?
pretty straight forward the father is greater than the son that's why the son sits on the right hand side of the father the Father is central to all things everything else is subordinate.   

Jesus was speaking as a person [in flesh]?

But he is still the son of God and as such he is the express image of his person     

During this time Jesus "obeyed His parents" - and He Obeyed the Father...
who was his parents we know God was his father but who was his mother Mary of course bore him but who was his spiritual mother I say Israel out of Israel would come the seed the branch the Messiah Gods crowning glory of creation     

All that He Jesus was doing  was "from the Father"...

Of course this is true it was the fathers plan that Christ was carrying out through him and for him all things were created         

This is why it says in John 5:19  Jesus gave them this answer: "Very truly I tell you, the Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees his Father doing, because whatever the Father does the Son also does.

Again this is true Jesus was the loving obedient son who always did the will of the Father       

This is why we read  John 14:9  Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father

So how shall we visualise Christ as at his first coming or his second I say his Second when he is united with his bride the church.     

And  - Hebrews 1:3 The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven.

Why would Jesus sit down at the right hand of God - when He is God ?

Is he God the Father where in scripture dose it say this in the above verse it says  exact representation of his being in KJV it says express image if Christ is the exact representation of his being and express image this to me means he is not the father but an exact replica not forgetting at the end of revelations he hands everything back to the father       


So we end with  - 1 Corinthians 15:27 For "God has put everything under His feet." Now when it says that everything has been put under Him, this clearly does not include the One who put everything under Him.

Here God is bowing down - giving over to His Son ?

everything will be put under his feet in the millenium he will be the supreme King of Kings and he will rule with his church and a rod of iron I don't think God is bowing down but bowing out he is handing over everything to the Son to finish the creation the millenium is the fathers sabbath rest 
Heb 4:1  Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.
   


   


Now answering the question of the free will of Jesus.... see: Matthew 11:27 All things have been entrusted to Me by My Father. No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal Him.

As Jesus had freewill to choose to obey or disobey so have we the easiest way to obey is through Love the Son is revealed all the way through scripture from the seed in Genesis to revelations and if we find Christ in Gods word then we find the father the son is the express image of the father       


Quote
I also want to emphasis and recall the point that God does not forget...

I'm also going to come to you, from  another angle now... in your time..

Although the "angel of death"/Destroyer/ passed over the egyptian camp [He did not touch those who had the Blood on the lintels and around the doorframes...

Exodus 12:23  When the LORD goes through the land to strike down the Egyptians, he will see the blood on the top and sides of the doorframe and will pass over that doorway, and he will not permit the destroyer to enter your houses and strike you down.



Thirdly and last...

Though you are forgiven through the blood of the Lamb - if God does not see your sins - then He cannot be the "all knowing God" - Omniscient....

hope you get the argument...[yes three points [I am a baptist] - naa not really .. joking..     


When we enter the Body of Christ we are clothed in his righteousness and this is what the father sees  he dose not see our sins because they are forgiven we are squeaky clean :D
It is through the blood of Christ we are cleansed and forgiven how wonderful is that.

Love and Peace
Dave 

Offline Tes Johnson

Re: Forgiveness, unconditionally
« Reply #121 on: December 27, 2018, 01:08:44 AM »
Quote
as in Jesus was speaking as a person [in flesh]?


Yes the word became flesh and lives/lived/  among us - as in John 1:14 The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us.




Offline Tes Johnson

Re: Forgiveness, unconditionally
« Reply #122 on: December 27, 2018, 01:25:10 AM »
Quote
Is he God the Father where in scripture dose it say this in the above verse it says  exact representation of his being in KJV it says express image if Christ is the exact representation of his being and express image this to me means he is not the father but an exact replica not forgetting at the end of revelations he hands everything back to the father




John 3:35  The Father loves the Son and has placed everything in his hands.



Not sure how the Father hands all things over - except I suppose in human reasoning "the father usually hands over to a son...

Being that God is speaking into our lives [being a usual life] where the son inherits from a father..

It would be normal for the father to retire and the son to continue..

Offline davetaff

Re: Forgiveness, unconditionally
« Reply #123 on: December 27, 2018, 02:51:49 PM »
Hi TJ

Thank you for your reply you said.


Quote
John 3:35  The Father loves the Son and has placed everything in his hands.


Not sure how the Father hands all things over - except I suppose in human reasoning "the father usually hands over to a son...

Being that God is speaking into our lives [being a usual life] where the son inherits from a father..

It would be normal for the father to retire and the son to continue..       


From the very beginning of creation God created everything through Christ and for Christ it was the father creating everything through Christ if we look at a little more from John 3


34  For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.
Joh 3:35  The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.
Joh 3:36  He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.     [/color]

As we see from verse 34 Christ speaks the word of God not his own words but Gods word which is Life.

Joh_14:10  Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.
       


so the father dose the work through Christ but at Christs second coming everything is given over to the son to finish the creation.

Rev_20:6  Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
     



So Christ shall reign as King of Kings for 1000 years to finish the creation which of course is mankind in the image of God this will happen at his second coming when all the faithful are resurrected and united with Christ man in the image of God.

Love and Peace

Dave

Offline Tes Johnson

Re: Forgiveness, unconditionally
« Reply #124 on: December 27, 2018, 10:18:42 PM »


 :great: - thats how God comuncates to  us/ in our day and age...

Through His Word /the bible - but also through the rhema  word...




Offline davetaff

Re: Forgiveness, unconditionally
« Reply #125 on: January 01, 2019, 02:15:45 PM »

 :great: - thats how God comuncates to  us/ in our day and age...

Through His Word /the bible - but also through the rhema  word...





Hi TJ
yes he dose but how often do we go beyond his word do we need to go back to basics and take the words he has given us to heart and not go of on tangents of our own imagination.
Bit like this thread it has come a long way from Johns original question  "  Forgiveness, unconditionally " or is that what Gods word is like a tree of life with different branches going in different directions but we must remember if we go to far along a branch we will fall of.

We must remember to stay attached to  the root and not go beyond what the word says we all have different opinions and thoughts and disagree on many things but always keep in mind that we cannot survive without the root this is what keeps the branches alive.

Happy new year
Love and Peace
Dave